So today, we’re gonna go over how to, build your authority site. We use this process, not just for, well, you can use this process for yourself, but we also use it for clients, and you can you can apply this across, different niches.

So I think if your member’s telling me this, like, fifteen years ago, Joanna, when I took the I think it was the the freelancer, the hundred thousand dollar freelancer, whereas really, like, the the main goals of your site is you wanna grow your list, you wanna sell your stuff, and then you you sell your other other people’s stuff. I remember when you said that to me, it just it really hit home and that’s, of course, it’s it’s true.

And that also may ultimately leads to the the top three things that that or the top three goals that we make sure all of our authority sites, achieve. First one is it needs to drive leads and sales. Second, it needs to build authority and trust. And the third thing is it needs to get remembered and shared, which I I know Joanna touched, on that the last meeting that we had. Now the metrics we used to measure success. We make sure that all of these are aligned to the goals that I I just discussed.

A lot of these are, super important. The the big ones are your customer lifetime value, your list growth rate, your lead conversion rate. A lot of these metrics if you move the needle even five percent, you’re gonna see a a lot of growth. So, we tend to focus on these. Now what we’ll do with these metrics is we’ll actually create a scorecard, and we’ll monitor them either weekly or monthly depending on on which ones.

More importantly, the is you wanna make sure that again that these are aligned to your goals.

I suggest you stick with the top three, but if for whatever reason, your your client or yourself, you wanna achieve something else, just make sure you can prove success or measure success.

So we’ll get into, the first step is really defining on what you want your site to achieve, what your the goals are, we’ll get into this actual process that we use to create the site.

It starts with identifying your most profitable customer. Now, what we suggest doing is you wanna identify the four percent of your customers that generates sixty four percent of your revenue.

We do that. What we do is we look at our customer list and we use lifetime value as the metric and then also repeat purchases or the number of purchases that people have made. And what we do is we we take that, we segment, and then from that, we’ll we’ll discover the four percent, and that’s who we’ll start with first.

Then we’ll use that list, and we’ll we’ll sort of pick and choose the next customer to start with, and then we’ll work through it one at a time. Basically, targeting a specific niche or market, and then moving on to the next.

The next stage is once you’ve identified your your your ideal prospect, you have them sorted, then you wanna conduct center interviews and and surveys and interviews.

We start by interviewing the customers, you know, your typical sort of what challenges you’re facing, you know, how’s our product help to your favorite features, a lot of these questions, and and I do have a copy of the, I think we have, like, fifty. No, I’ve actually over a hundred questions now.

Of different ways that you can ask them, and different, they’re all organized by stages of awareness, but I’ll share this with you at the end. And essentially, what you’re looking for is not just understand the problem, understand that obviously the outcome they want or the solution, but also These are questions that are gonna help you uncover your your value prop, your USB.

A lot of these questions, like, why which specific features did you like or or what made you choose us over the competition, you’re gonna get all of that stuff from these interviews, and that’s what you’re really gonna start using to create your USB and value prop.

So the next person you need to interview is you. So you need to interview yourself. This is all the stuff that we’re going through the, copy hackers as well. Books, success stories, case studies, your podcast, events, everything about you, your origin story, which, I’m gonna do another session on this.

And, your origin story is all a bit of creating trust. It’s it’s, hey, you understand the problem and, you know, they they can relate to you. You’re likable, and you’ll do that early on. So we’ll cover another session on that.

And, of course, your USB and your unique mechanism, you’ll get your USB from the customer surveys. Your unique mechanism, is once you know what or you have a better idea on why they chose you, then you can hammer out the details. That’s really the how it works. So that’s the part that you’re gonna focus on yourself.

Now once you have all this information, the second step you need to do is you need to analyze the the results. Okay? So what you’re really doing here is you’re you’re looking you’re looking for themes. I use AI for this.

AI is really good at this where they can identify common themes you you really wanna get in the mind. You understand. You wanna understand why they tick. You know, what’s the specific problem they wanna solve?

What specific outcome?

You wanna understand their their top hesitations because then you can draft a guarantee to address those.

So really, you’ll find some really cool stuff from this. I is probably one of my favorite parts, to be honest.

And we’ll show you we have tools at the end as well, which we’ll give you access to, and that’ll help you sort of categorize in segment.

Then what we do from that, and this is the the fun part I enjoy as well is we create an avatar. Now, and again, I’ll give you the templates at the end. We just don’t create your typical avatar with as, you know, your demographics, like, psychographics. What we do is and I got this from you, Joanna, is we this is almost like two point o version of the rule of one, or your one reader. So it’s not just understanding, their problem and concerns. But it’s also listing, you know, hey, these are the hesitations aligning a guarantee to that, figuring out what are what what hard offers are gonna resonate with them, what soft offers are gonna are gonna resonate with them. And then this is where you start filling in your USPS, your value prop, and all the other stuff as well.

And again, you’re gonna use this from the the survey data that you’ve, you, you, got from before. Now, the trick on this as well is you’ll have your most profitable customer. You wanna take that customer and you also wanna create an avatar avatar by stages of awareness if you can.

And then you wanna repeat that for each of your, your avatars moving forward as well. Next step that we do is we create a sitemap.

These are the core pages on your site that, we find, it’s a good start anyways. There’s your homepage. Which will break down in a second because your homepage really tells a great story, and it’s organized by the stages of awareness.

There’s your about page, which is your origin story. There’s your process, which is how it works. And that’s it’s it’s your USB, but it also includes the the secret sauce, you know, the that how your solution, you know, achieves consistent results better than the competition. And that’s really how you’re gonna outline it step by step.

Success stories, of course, your work with me, which is your services, product type services, your your courses, whatever you wanna offer, books, blog, consult, contact, media, resources, speaking, connect, and then your typical four zero four, thank you and and FAQ pages with a a guarantee as well. I like this section right here because it’s it’s almost like, you wanna address their hesitations and concerns. A lot of people overlook the purpose of the FAQ page. So you wanna you definitely wanna test that out as well if you can.

A little tip, insider tip on this is If you are in a city, let’s say you have a productized services on, web design, and you have a system where you can put this really cool package together for clients, and you can productize it, and you’re in a in a city, say you’re in Toronto, what you wanna do is you wanna create a city page, that’s this Toronto web design, but don’t put it on your main navigation. Just put it in your HTML site map. Because then what’s gonna happen is it’s still gonna get linked to the rest of the pages. You’re gonna link to use, but then it’s also gonna, it’ll rank, but then you can also link to it from your GMB profile.

So then it’s just an added sort of boost that you can get more traffic and sales from it as well. I’ll be doing a session on that on how to set that up. And and show you, how to create that city page. And the cool thing is with the city page, it’s actually, organized by, not only stages of awareness, but it uses ADA.

It’s pretty cool how everything aligns up on it.

Next is your homepage. So this is where we start, we start with this. And remember, we’re we’re creating the home page and we’re using all of the data that you’ve collected from your surveys, your avatar so you can start telling great story because you know exactly who you’re writing for. That’s that’s what’s key about this.

These are the main components of the of the the home page, and I’ll give you a, wireframe split. I I’ll use the terms spid draft and wireframe at the end that you can use. And, it contains only sections. So you have your header with Hero Shot, UV, your email opt in, which is above the fold, your compelling, story, which is your origin story. Credibility and social proof, your work with me, which are your services page, your speaking, your programs, your content preview, which is, of course, is your blog, your your podcast social connect and then, of course, your footer, which is your you wanna end with a strong CTA.

Now here’s how each of them kinda tells a story. So you’re starting with the header, your hero shot, UVP.

Really, this is the first impression. It’s it’s what’s gonna grab their attention gonna explain what you do who it’s for and the big benefit. You know, we this is your, you know, why why choose me versus the competition. So you’re really setting the stage at this point.

There’s a couple of examples that I’ve included. You know, I help entrepreneurs, build and grow profitable platforms, very clear.

Build your business, build your wealth, live your dream. It’s clear. I love this one.

This is like a two point o. You know, welcome to the the Fitfather project.

It’s, I think that he he nails it really well.

Second is you’re featured in. These are your your media logos across, you know, right off the bat. This is gonna create that credibility. It’s gonna show like, hey, I can trust them. Like, what they’re saying is true.

A couple of examples, this is like kind of a what most people do, it works. It’s kind of okay.

This is a better example of it as featured in trusted by. Again, I love this version. I think it’s like two point o. It just it hits you.

So you don’t have fun with this, but you’re you’re really saying, hey, like, I not only understand you, but what I’m what I’m saying is true. You can trust what I’m saying.

Next part is your email opt in, so your you’re placing this next, it’s really that, like, the way to say, Hey, you know, like, get to know me a bit more. You know, you’re you’re in you’re giving that option right away. You’re hinting at that value. Hey, there’s more to come.

Here’s a couple of examples of your, your email. There’s million. There’s a the urban monk seven day reboot, get started now. Just, you know, it’s not much.

It’s just a way to collect your email and and, and get them into, or or start the the process anyways. Here’s your origin, your your hook. This is the part I love. This is your origin story.

On your homepage, you’re just gonna literally just create a little snippet and link to your orange and story page. And that’s really how that homepage is aligned as well. You notice that each section, it is correlates to the navigation as well. So that’s what you’re you’re doing.

You’re just linking to each one. A couple of examples of origin stories.

Here, here’s another one, how I got here. It’s pretty, you know, the these are revealing to the are, you know, he’s talking about his PTSD.

Just when I thought I was on top of the world, she’s, you know, she’s gonna go into, you know, what, her problems and She’s really trying to relate to people. It’s like, hey, they understand me. They get me, which is which is really cool. Here’s another one, the truth you may not know about me, and it’s it’s his about page.

And that’s these are gonna be your about about us page. Some people call it origin story, but I just call it about us. Here’s another one, Sharpen. He’s he’s a good guy, Sharpen, actually, I’ve met him a few times.

He’s pretty good training. Credibility, media logos. That’s the next step. This is just to, you know, we’re building on those initial crust, the credibility signals.

We’re deepening that trust.

We’re we’re starting to get into our expertise, you know, the the the impact, the solution that we offer.

Here’s a couple of examples as well.

We’re getting into best selling books, like, you know, the and and that’s the psychology here is your you’re thinking, hey, well, this, you know, you see someone with these best selling books. They must know their stuff, right? And that’s really the point of, of, publishing your book is you’re creating out authority in their eyes, and it’s just gonna make you a hell of a lot easier selling your products and services. Then we’re getting in a social proof this is the praise your photos.

Hey, if it worked for for them, it can work for me too type stuff.

Here’s a couple of great examples for Tony Robbins everyone knows Tony Robbins, your typical testimonials, then we’re getting into your work with me.

Now that they trust you, they believe what you’re telling is true. They think the solution is for them. Now you’re gonna start introducing what you do, right, and it can be anything from services, to coaching.

It really depends on on what you’re offering. Then you get into for our clients, obviously, it’s their services they offer. There’s a lot of spaces in cosmetic, so we would get into the cosmetic services they would offer.

Here’s the content preview. This is this is really about like establishing further and giving a taste of, you know, what what what they can learn by by, following you. So you here’s your library, your podcast library, learn from me. Here’s my blog. Then you’re getting your social connections.

This is cool. It’s just like, hey, you know, connect with me. You know, here’s here’s the value I bring. It’s your your making that introduction for them to to reach out, then you have your footer, which of course ends in a strong CTA, and you’re just reinforcing that again.

Couple examples as well. A lot of people don’t put the, they’re they’re called actions in these CAAs. You wanna be in the footer, you wanna make sure you do that.

And you can do this yourself. That’s the process we use for the home page. We do have a, a site map and sorry, spit draft and wireframe, which will will give you not just for the home page, but it’s all of the pages of the site.

How we do it is, again, I learned this from Joanna, is we we start with what we wanna say, and then what we do is we overlay proven copywriting formulas on top of that, and then you have a pretty compelling site, which is, which is gonna rank and sell and convert and do really well.

We’ll provide you with all of these tools at the end. So don’t worry about that. I’ll I’ll give you access to everything.

What I wanted to talk today was to to show you a concept of how this works and really using your using your the the data that you get from your surveys and and how you can use it, and not just just to show it’s not. It doesn’t have to be complicated, and how you can craft the UVP for your homepage yourself.

These are questions and I’ll I, I just went over, but I’ll share with them with you as well. So now and I’ll use ourself as an example. So we, we’re launching a product, and it’s called or a service called WP Total Care. And, we’ve been offering WordPress support for our clients now for a couple of years. So we wanna it’s worked really well. So we wanna take this a bit further. So we analyze our list, our current customers, and we thought it was small business owners with a WordPress website specifically with woocommerce.

And we analyzed this list, and we actually discovered it’s not It’s actually, brand agencies. They’re the four percent of customers that generate sixty four percent of our revenue. So after analyzing that, we just literally put, you know, brand agency. Then we we asked them the the specific problem, and and we wanted to know the outcome that they wanted.

And for them, it was, they’re because they they’re a brand agency, they do they’re clients, they’ll help their client with their branding, and it often ends up leading to online or digital media, often like a website or whatnot. So what they would do in the past is they would reach out to freelancers or they would work with freelancers and the problem is the the inconsistent results, you know, the the freelancers just disappear on them sometimes. So That was the main challenge they were they were dealing with. The specific result, they wanted they just wanted a reliable partner they can count on.

We we did speak to them a little bit more. We wanted to dig into the ultimate benefit, and it was like, yeah, they wanted to rely reliable partner, but in the end, it was so they could grow their business because they realized there’s this big opportunity they didn’t have the the means in house or they didn’t they didn’t want to invest in someone, in house so they really wanted that partner to help them grow and take their agency to the next level.

That, of course, led us to the the promise, and this is where we really we asked them, you know, what why did you choose us over the competition? And there’s a few things that stood out for them. The first one was we specialize in WordPress. Our developers have contributed to the core.

So that’s just gonna lend our expertise. And the big one was is we have a white label option where, they can they’ll use our services. Their clients don’t know because they’re white labeling, but the plugin that we they can use in the back end of their website. They can engage and speak to clients, and they can manage their client’s website through that.

So that was something the competition doesn’t offer, and those were, you know, the top three reasons people chose us. So, of course, that’s our promise.

The proof was up to us, and and that’s just when we’re doing the interviews. We’re just gonna, hey, you know, do you mind if we we we interview, you know, so we can we can tell your story, and we can share your story. So we’re gonna use those. We’re gonna use demos.

We have a lot of, we have a lot of examples of before and after where we’ve optimized websites, especially with Google’s web vitals as far as page based paid speed and and whatnot. So these are pretty powerful, and we can use those to really validate and and and show or prove what we’re saying is true, as far as our our promise. Right? And one thing I wanna touch on this is the the promise is really about, the promise is your, you wanna switch to unique benefits because there’s, like, there’s three types of benefits.

The first type of benefit is the benefit that your customers don’t care about avoid them. Second type of benefit are these are your price of entry benefits. So these are the benefits that they expect to see when they go to your site. So you need to have those.

It’s, like, the minimum that your prospect expects. Then there’s their point of difference benefits, and these are the benefits that you’re gonna use to beat your competitors.

So when we interviewed our clients, we discovered, you know, the minimum requirements, the minimum we need to to sort of play the game. And then, of course, we we discovered the the point of difference benefits to win the game. That’s the way I like to look at it.

And then, of course, the proposition, these are the products that, they wanted to see. You know, the this is a really telling question as well. And we have a lot of these. There’s different ways to phrase it.

But when you’re creating your offers, let your customers or, your leads, let them tell you the type of offers that you wanna create.

So just, you know, asking these types of questions and that they’ll tell you.

Then once you have all of your answers from the interviews, you’re literally just gonna, you know, here is their their frustrated, you know, agencies, quality. Right? They’re they’re they’re they’re frustrated with quality from freelancer. So all you’re doing literally is you’re taking that and you’re you’re popping it in. That’s it. And then once that’s done, you’re just gonna take this formula and then you’ll rewrite the formula, easy peasy.

And test this stuff. There’s different formulas that you can use. You can test them. You can rotate them. Make sure that you’re your visual here, your image is it shows the transformation or the outcome that they wanna achieve. And then, of course, you’re just highlighting your your point of different benefits under here, which I just told you about, as well. We specialize in WordPress where, we contribute to the core, we white label a plugin, and then, of course, you’re just ending it with another formula is to get the desired result that they want.

So it all plays together. The your you’re identifying just a recap. You’re identifying your ideal prospect. You’re and your ideal prospect you’re gonna start with is your most profitable. You’re getting into the mind of that that customer, you’re doing that by interviewing, you’re understanding the problem, the challenges, the frustrations, the outcome, not just that, but also their hesitations and concerns. And you’re asking all this stuff so you can really meet it head on, especially with, you know, if you if you discover that one of their concerns is that, you know, you don’t have a level of expertise in WordPress, well, you’re gonna guarantee that you do. You wanna align that as much as possible.

And you’re taking that survey data, and then you’re analyzing it, and then you’re using it in your copy, and you’re using it to create your website. And and that’s what’s really powerful about it. And then you’re just once once you have and you understand it, you’re just using proven copywriting formulas and frameworks, and that’s it. And then you’re just making sure everything follows, tells a story or, has a, yeah, tells tells a great story, and It’s, yeah, it’s a lot of fun. And then you get into your split testing and your, your testing and everything else.

Any questions so far?

Yeah. I have two.

Yeah. For sure.

The the first one? So with the stuff, like, around your IDel avatar, what would you recommend if you’re in a position where You don’t really know.

You haven’t worked yet with your ID levator. Like, you have an idea of them, like you’ve outpriced your current client, so you wanna sub new ones, but you can’t interview them because you’ve not worked with them before. Like, where would you recommend you start?

I can show you what we did. So we did, So we we, we scraped all of our competitors, when we first started doing it. Here, I’ll show you, am I still sharing my screen? Yeah.

I am. Okay. So we had, this what we did. So we went out and and just scraped all our competitor reviews and and we analyzed everything.

Right? And we we looked for, their USB, everything a to z. So that that’s what I would suggest doing. Is pretty telling as well.

Like, we we go pretty heavy into analyzing our competitors. We we we do everything from sign up for consultations we wanna know their sales funnel, their strengths, their weaknesses, because ultimately, you you wanna you wanna match them and then you wanna beat them. Right? And you you do that by understanding them and also listening to your customers as well.

That’s what I would suggest doing.

Okay. Thank you.

Who are your competitors, by the way? Do you know?

Not really because, like, I don’t know that my competitors are like copywriters. They’re more like coaches, or con consoled like So, yeah, I’m not I’m not sure of any any other copywriters, like, in my space.

Yeah. We go pretty deep. Like, you can you you’ll find them out, like, a good a good approach to do is, we use data to sort of figure who who is our competition, and then we we get into Once you know who they are and it kinda leads to the next one, like you can figure out their entire marketing strategy. It’s it’s pretty straightforward once you know who they are. And then that, like I said, that’s gonna lead to another competitor, another competitor, and then you just focus on the top twenty percent. That you know are dominating the market, and then that that’s where you start laying your recipe.

Mhmm. That makes sense. Thanks. And, yeah, the other question is just a silly little one.

For, like, having the logos underneath the, like, trusted by, do you need permission to do that? Like, assuming there’s nothing in the ended ending NDA that says against it? Like, do you still need to ask to include the logo on your page?

Not that we had, in Slack, someone we had, we talked about that as well.

Oh, really?

I used them.

Like, it’s not it’s if it’s if it’s legit, of course, I don’t unless there’s, like, an NDA or something.

Okay. Agreed. We use them and others use ours without ever asking. So Yeah.

I I’d never asked you, Joe, but It’d be good.

Cool. Thank you.

Yeah. No problem.

Anyone else? Any other shy folk who are off camera?

Shade, where did four percent and sixty four percent come from?

So it’s the eighty twenty rule. I don’t know if you heard about that. So twenty percent of your customers will eighty percent of your revenue. So what you’re doing is you’re taking that twenty percent and you’re applying the same formula again.

So you’re looking at your the twenty percent the twenty percent of that that generate eighty is zero sixty four. That’s where it comes from. So it’s just another layer. So a lot of people just start with that’s good enough.

But if you wanna get ultra specific, and the goal here is, like, to is to define your most profitable customer. And that’s, like, the you do that by analyzing your list and you use lifetime value as the metric. That’s what key that’s what’s key. And then, and once you know that, then you just you sort and you you pick one at a time.

Dominate that. Move on to the next.

Well, thank you.

Yeah. No problem.

I had a question. If we’re, like, redefining our offer or our niche, and we kind of try and we’re kind of trying to get something up would you recommend, like, still starting out to build out the authorities site with all the pages or sticking to, like, a one page site where we can collect leads before building out the fuller version?

We’ll start growing your list. Like, you don’t want to put it up right away. Like, don’t I wouldn’t wait until your site is, like, completely done. Right? Anything is good enough.

But that’s, like, you’re you’re saying before you do all the interviews and all that other stuff, like, before you Yeah. Put up what you have. Of course. Like, this is a process.

It’s not it’s, ideally, you wanna start with this, but you may have, you may have a site up. And you’re gonna go in and you’re gonna, you know, you’re not gonna tear it down. You may or may not, but it’s, is a process. Right?

You may start with a page.

You may say, hey, I’m gonna I’m gonna write my origin story, and then you you add that. You update your your Vode OS page. Right?

Okay. That’s helpful.

Shane, can I ask a visuals question?

Sure.

So I noticed I went to a lot of agency competitors.

I think who might be my competitors, and I noticed that a lot of them don’t do the person in the hero section. A lot of them don’t really have a whole lot of any noticeable imagery in the hero section really.

And I’m just wondering, like, I don’t have a photo shoot. I’m not scheduling one right now. I really don’t want to spend the money on it frankly.

At least not for a little while. What When it comes to the imagery, especially in the hero section, but even I guess going down the page in the home on the home page, any recommendations because I’m kind of at a loss. It gets me spiraling. That’s stupid.

I always see this. It’s either the person you know, like Joe has on hers or the agency competition like I said doesn’t seem to go by that. They didn’t have very little. So I’m just kind of struggling to figure out what’s the right image. Should I spend the money and go do something or I don’t know what’s your recommendation on all that stuff?

Don’t know. It depends. Like, it could be you could go stage as awareness and focus on, like, the outcome that they want. It depends on the industry too, right, on the space, like, or before and after. I’m gonna show the outcome gonna show that before and after. If they’re if they’re product aware they know the results, I’m gonna focus on why they need to choose me. Right?

That’s what I would start with. It’s not I don’t think there’s, like, everyone says there’s best practices, but I’ve we’ve done, like, testing, especially with Google ads and what we thought worked wouldn’t is complete opposite. Right? So, you know, I don’t unless Joe, I don’t know what your thoughts are on that, but I don’t think, you know, start with the basics, like, include your and just, maybe focus on the outcome, right, the solution they’re looking for.

Okay. Thanks.

Any other Everyone’s so quiet.

I mean, I will have to end this question. If your community’s there. So if no one has any more, I was wondering if you could talk a bit about, like, the types of guarantees you would offer as a service provider.

It depends on yeah.

So the the guarantees are gonna be, you’re gonna offer your guarantees to address their concerns, right, that your guarantee has to have a purpose, a goal, and your guarantee is literally to address their hesitations. Right? If they say they’re worried about this. You’re gonna offer a guarantee that, you know, that says, Hey, you don’t need to worry about it. That’s what it is.

But if they’re worried about results, like that seems to be the main thing, but it’s like, I can’t offer a guarantee around results.

What type of results?

Like, are they like well, I suppose actually this probably comes down to me targeting the wrong people.

Like, yeah, they just wanna know that they’ll that it will convert. But then I think that’s probably more where I’m talking people who with less money, who care more. So Yeah. I kind of answered my question.

No. Like, they’re they’re worried about results that they’re not gonna achieve the results sort of thing?

Yeah. Like, they just wanna know the copy’s gonna convert. Like, that that’s the hesitation. It’s like, can you make me more money?

So you can also guarantee something. Like, a guarantee is like, yeah, hey, it’s not just about results, but you can guarantee, so how I would answer that is is, like, I’ll show you what I would do, and then you can you can see there’s different ways to approach it I would show so say you’re a client, right, and let me open this up.

So I would say I would say to you, so I’ll pretend you’re the client. You’d say, well, how do you know you guys can see the screen?

Okay. So you’d say, well, how do you guarantee results? And I’d say, well, this is how I would address it. I’d say, well, you know, you’re working with us because we focus on on results.

You know, we we measure campaign success by ROI, and that really answers the question. Did you make money? And we we manage it around true ROI, not return on ad spend. So we take in account gross margin.

And you’re a business owner, so you’re thinking, okay. Good. This guy knows gross margin. He’s speaking my language.

And I would say, okay. Well, let’s say you work with us and we’re gonna launch a Facebook campaign. And then, like, yeah, we sent a thousand visitors and then would say we have it cost you ten thousand, right, to hire us. This is what you’re talking about is your conversion rate and say that your conversion rate is three percent.

That’s your landing page or your sales page that is gonna convert. This is how many customers, turn in, sorry, leads turn into customers. This is lifetime value. You’ll have to work with that with the client, and then let’s say it’s like sixty five percent margin.

So what I would say is while you’re hiring me for this metric, right? You’re hiring me because because most come in at around three percent. We’re gonna use that as a baseline, but we’re gonna have a control then, and we’re gonna work to increase that. So over time, you know, we can get that, say, from three to five percent and then watch your ROI.

It’s just gonna explode. But more importantly, what I wanna talk to you of it is I wanna make sure, you know, we don’t know how many your close, sales you’re closing yet. You know, if you’re only in most close around thirty percent, but like, hey, you know, you’re hiring me, we’re gonna work with you unconsulted at selling. We’re gonna put this at thirty five percent and watch your ROI.

It’s gonna explode.

Right? And so, and then we’re gonna talk about lifetime value, where we’re gonna do an upsell or something on the thank you page, and we’re gonna increase this by a hundred and watch the ROI.

So I’ve never what I’ve done is I’ve answered your questions. Like, I positioned myself as an authority. I’ve spoke his language, but I really promise nothing. I’d promise him that or her that we’re gonna have a control, and we’re gonna try to beat the control. Right? But I’m using my expertise to reinforce, like, hey, we’re all about results too. You see the subtle difference.

And that’s that’s the approach that we take. And it works really well because no other agencies talk like that. I can promise you. Like, no or marketers, direct response, direct response marketer would. But, a lot of, or copywriters, they won’t. But that’s that’s the language, that’s how I would approach it. So it’s a guarantee without you know, without a guarantee in a sense, if that makes sense.

Yeah. No. That’s good. Thank you.

No worries.

If I can just jump on that question Sure.

So you just walked through is what I walked a prospect through yesterday.

Good for you.

And it was it was good, but now that I now that I see you walk through it again, I realized I made some mistakes because my guarantee was more tying myself into a guarantee.

It okay if I share my screen and just show you Yeah.

Of course. Okay. Cool.

Okay.

So because the project is primarily just email marketing, So I didn’t include all those other aspects. So I just kind of took their list size, their profit margin, their average order value and their average orders per month. And I kind this is the so they’re currently doing nothing with email. So my guarantee in quote was, like, I’ll increase that zero, percent of revenue being attributed to email to twenty percent.

And by doing that, they’ll get a one hundred and forty additional, orders per month and this will equate to this amount in sales revenue and then profit. And then that was how I calculated the ROI. So for the ROI, just removed a monthly retainer fee. I gave them I did five six as a monthly retainer fee for that.

So I kind of tied myself into that percentage of additional revenue, like additional, email revenue, and I’m just wondering if that is dangerous as a guarantee to give.

Yeah.

I wouldn’t. I wouldn’t give that because you’re being ultra specific great. You’re guaranteeing, like, you’re guaranteeing the process. You’re guaranteeing you’re guaranteeing that, you know, you’re gonna do your job, you’re gonna do it well. And it’s like you have that level of expertise and that means that you’re gonna have a control. You’re gonna work towards beating it, and you’re gonna apply, like, proven frameworks, formulas, that’s that’s your guarantee. Right?

You you can say, like, you can, hey, imagine getting this and you can paint that picture and get them excited.

Right? Because that’s your ultimate goal. Like, if you’re not if you’re not increasing if you have a control and you’re not beating it, constantly, you’re not doing testing and stuff, then it the client’s gonna pick up on it. I would pitch that, but it is a subtle difference, though.

Right? You’re you’re pitching you. You’re pitching and you’re you’re using the results, like imagine, hey, and you’re building that excitement. But you’re letting them know it’s a process.

It’s built into into conversion copywriting. Right?

Yeah. I also gave, like, a timeline. Like, there’ll be some setup, there’ll be some setup time in month one. Month two. We’re just pull putting out the emails, so we’re still setting it up. So that guarantee was more of, like, ninety one twenty days from now. So that was kind of how I gave myself some room, but that’s still kind of dangerous.

I’ll say. Yeah. Just be careful on that. Like, you you wanna you’re gonna benchmark everything first.

And then you’re, obviously, you’re gonna benchmark because you need to show that you, you, you have to show success, right? But don’t don’t promise anything far as, you know, actual numbers. That’s that’s tricky to get into. Right?

I wouldn’t and then just promise, like, the the process, the how you’re gonna get in there, you’re gonna you’re gonna have these benchmarks. You have your controls, and you’re gonna work to beat them, and this is how. And then the how is conversion copywriting, right, the interviews, the the, voice of customer, all that stuff.

Okay. So if I can ask, what would you advise I do at this point? Because I’m having another call with them to, like, close the deal.

So kind of how do I back myself away from it, but still offering some kind some kind of Well, this it’s the subtle approach.

Like, just say like, did you say you’re gonna get I don’t know. Did you say you’re gonna get these exact these numbers.

Like, you’re gonna I guarantee within six months, you’re gonna have So it was a three month timeline for at least ten percent of revenue starting to come from email because they have a big list and the list is warm and they’re all How much revenue are they making now?

Like, do you know that?

As a company as a whole?

No. From the from that. Like, if you what is the the current yeah.

They’re they’re barely doing anything with email right now. But sometimes they send offers to the list and it convert and they convert. So that was what I was thinking.

Oh, I’ll be How big is their list?

Ninety k.

Oh, I don’t know. It should I don’t wanna say I I don’t know. I’d that kind of stuff, like, it’s I’ve I’ve been burnt on that. Like, it’s like you you think and it just I always pitch the process, like, see if you can you can sort of if you promise them already, like, see if you can dumb it down a bit maybe and just say, hey, you know, here’s here’s the benchmark. Here’s what we’re gonna start with. I’m gonna apply these. I’m gonna do this to try to get it to this, and this is hopefully what we can expect.

You know, but reminding them, hey, this is a process. Right? You can’t you can’t guarantee your but that’s the beauty of your process is you have a control and then you always work to beat it. Right?

That’s the way I would position it.

Okay.

Sounds good. Thank you. Yeah.

That’s a tough one. Like, it’s not, Right? I’ve been burned. I’ve back when I started my career, like, way back when I I learned a hard lesson from that. Just not to, not to.

Thank you. Yeah. No worries.

Any other Any questions on the process on the on building the site, using VOC, the survey data, Anything along that lines? On do we’re doing this for your your clients as well. This is also a service that you can offer to clients.

A lot of those pages, you’re just switching it up. Right?

They’ll have certification. We do this a lot for, for our clients.

Shane, if I can ask a question sorry. That’s, kind of adjacent to Abby’s question about, like, dumping audiences.

Like, so I did a competitor’s content analysis, but like what Abby was saying, I find that a lot of people making similar promises to what I’m claiming I can do are Like, it’s not just apples to apples with other copywriters. It is other digital marketing agencies.

It is coaches. And now, obviously, I’m getting, like, mega targeted with ads for everybody who does anything close to what I do.

So I just I guess, like, do you have any tips for narrowing down the competitors that you choose for that analysis or because obviously we only see the front end. We don’t know how successful that they’re they actually are or what kind of market where they have, or which ones we want to be comparing ourselves to and differentiating ourselves from.

Well, what do you it’s like, what are you defining us? For us, it’s revenue, right, market share.

What you can do for market share is you can look at their brand terms. Usually, phrases that people, brand term is not just the their name or their business name, but also the products that they sell. And you can gauge that as popularity. That’s that’s an option.

What else? If if you’re looking at revenue, there’s social shares. You can see how how popular the content is as well. That’s what we do. But you’ll find that once especially look at Google ads if they do spend a lot on Google ads, especially especially Google ads, not so much Facebook, but look at Google ads, and if they’re if they’re advertising, they usually know their stuff and then look at people also advertising within that space and then you’re gonna start to see patterns, right?

Especially in a competitor space, like if they’re paying six, twelve bucks a click, they’re they’re making sure it’s laser focused. Right? Yeah. That’s what we do.

Yeah, it just it it takes a while, but you’ll find it it it kinda leads one to another. Right? And then you do have to beat them though. You have to analyze them and you have to figure out, hey, like, you there there is your price of entry.

That that’s what, like, your prospect expects the the they come to your site. You have to meet this minimum requirement or they won’t consider you as an option.

You have to have that. And, give me an example. We had a executive health clinics. So there are certain people, these are private clinics in Canada, So there’s certain things that they expect a private clinic to have to even consider them.

Then you have to look at the competition. You say, okay, what’s something I can offer that’s gonna beat them? That still resonates with my ideal prospects. Something they want, how can I set myself apart because you need the apples to oranges compared person, right?

And if you’re in coaching selling products, that’s what’s going through their mind. Like, either saying, okay, I trust what you’re saying is true, and their product aware. I I trust what you’re saying is true. I I wanna believe what you’re saying is true, but like why should I choose you over the titian.

Why should I choose you over this coach? You know, why is your solution different or how can your solution help me solve my problem better than them? And that’s where you can differentiate yourself with, like, your USB.

But it’s not just your USB. It’s like how it works, like, how your secret sauce, your coaching program, how it helps them solve their problem. Like, it’s the secret that you’ve discovered that helps them solve their problem and get the outcome consistently better than everyone else.

And that’s something that’s pretty powerful and that’s that’s what you can use to separate yourself. That’s what we do.

And then you have that distinction. Right? You have your point of difference, your point of entry, your USB to sort of sum it up and then you use your credibility boosters. All the stuff like Joanna certification, your testimonials and stuff, you’ll use that to kinda support your your your u s p, like your apples to oranges. Does that make sense?

Yeah. Yeah.

So yep.

Being of, like, that’s that’s essentially where you’re going in for the differentiation.

Bingo. That’s that’s the good way, especially, like, if you’re in a coaching, that’s a level three market sophistication. And what that means is, like, people don’t respond to benefits anymore. They’ve heard it all.

The only thing they respond to and it’s getting to, but they respond to how it works. They wanna know why your solution is better than the competition, then they want to dig in because they want to learn it, right? You’re selling them a process, you’re selling them a secret, a results recipe, whatever you want to call it. That does x y z better than everyone else, and you need to sell them on that, but that’s going to create your apples to oranges.

A lot of your competitors will use like everyone Hammers home like reviews testimonials and stuff, that stuff is important. Yes. But you’re using that to reinforce your your your USB. There’s a subtle difference, but it’s really powerful.

Like, you’re using, you know, these credibility boosters to say, yeah, what they’re saying is true. Her solution is better than the competition. There’s a big difference, right, and then it’s reinforcing it. So that’s what I would do if you’re looking for that apples to oranges comparison.

Said, does that help?

Yep. Yeah.

Did do you have it unique? Like, have you have you thought of it? Like, how are how are you separating yourself from the competition? Like, what what angle have you taken?

Like, which angle am I not taking more? I think more about choosing like, I do on my talk about my process. So I have like, you know, immersion, creation, refinement is like my three step process, and I talk a lot about was of customer research in my marketing because I found, like, when I had that messaging, a lot of my competition was more about, like, speaking your troops, you know, and I was like, no, boo. Don’t, like, it’s not about your voice. It’s about your your market’s voice.

But I feel like yeah. I’m looking for what that needs to be now based on ongoing conversations about what my, one thing is gonna be.

Yeah. Like, why it’s if you can’t if I asked you right now, why should I choose you over the competition?

Can you, and that’s that’s the question, right?

And it’s like, and it depends on what you’re coming to me for.

Like, I that’s where so I’m I’m still in the mud about, like, what the offer is going to be. So I feel like I don’t know how to differentiate I’m, like, is it the dumpster you call energy? Is it the, like, something else?

So Let’s see what you’re saying.

So you don’t you’re you start you’re trying to finalize your offer. And then once you know your offer, what the the what, then you’re gonna then you can get into the sorta, I see what you’re saying.

We we do have, like, the the list that we’re sending you, I’ll share the screen and show you on his guys on it as well. We do have, some really good questions broken down by stages of awareness that will help you discover that stuff. And you can send where are we here?

Yeah. But also, I’m gonna send I’m gonna send all the the tools. But basically, those there’s ton. There’s over a hundred and they’re they’re different questions asked by different influencers in the space, and some of them are really good to discover the stuff that you should be, selling, right, to to create your offers as well. Maybe use that as a guide to get started.

Okay. Thank you.

If that helps.

Yeah. And if I may I might I have, like, the results of my competitors’ content audit in a spreadsheet. So I’d love to share that in the group if you wouldn’t mind, like, if you see an where you’re like, oh, there’s com then deems coming out.

Have you, have you analyzed, like, have you looked at what their USB is?

Like, do you know what their, have you, have you learned anything, like, looked for any patterns, or I, no, I don’t say that.

I don’t think there’s like one trend that I could take away. It was just like while there are so many people coming at this from different angles, that I feel like we’re all constantly the same thing. So where am I gonna go in my approach.

And who, like, describe your ideal prospect, like, in and and that was part of the exercise as well. Like, describe them in one or two sentences. Like, who who are they? What’s what’s their problem? What’s their frustration? What’s the outcome they want?

I would say established business owners in the online space. So usually course, coaches or experts who have a coaching program.

Who wanna go from, like, low six figures to multi six and seven figures with a signature offer you know, and they want their launches to feel easier and they want more consistent sales coming in everyone. So generating that monthly recurring revenue.

Absolutely.

They reached a plateau where they’re just not their signature offer isn’t they want to take it to the next level sort of thing? Okay. So that’s good. So now you, like, you’re you’re laser focused, right?

You’re focused on on a specific audience, like within a you know the income, the revenue that they’re generating from their offer. So that that’s a great start. I just figure, like, what how can you what so your offer is gonna help them, increase revenue. It’s it’s gonna help them get to the next level of benchmark of revenue that you’re you’re gonna whatever that is.

Right? Like, how does it how do you help them solve that? How do you help them get the outcome? And that, have you figured that out like your process?

No. Well, because that’s the thing. It’s like, which so far I’ve just been doing I’ve been, like, specializing Everybody I work with has a signature offer, but I have done all kinds of different things for them.

Like, the sales page, the launch emails, the I got you.

So I’m like, what is my best? I know the who, but, like, what is my best call for for that audience.

Is it more the how? Is your is the is it should just switch that maybe to how? Like, you know, you know the problem, you know the outcome, and now you have to craft an offer to help them achieve that outcome. And that that that is gonna position you or separate you from the competition. Right?

So if they want to, you know, what is what is the how that I feel confident I can deliver on? Like, what’s the how, you know, So what so what’s the exact outcome?

Like, in one sentence, what’s the exact outcome they want? In one sentence, if you can.

Doesn’t be perfect, but, like Oh, I’m gonna just so here, because I’m gonna use the words she banned me from using, which I’m, like, profitable signature offer.

Right? The to be to be getting back to, like, taking home more money from their existing launches, their existing offers.

Add more to their plate.

Okay. So that they’ve reached a plateau, you’re gonna help them get to the next level, whatever that is. Now you need to now you need to tell me and that’s your secret sauce. That that’s your u s p.

Like that or it’s a common it’s a combination of how it works how specifically that’s your offer, how specifically are you gonna help them achieve that? Because you have a secret you have a secret sauce that you’ve discovered and you’re gonna work with them and you this secret recipe that you have will help them consistently get the results and they don’t know it. You know it and you’re gonna share it with them. And that’s why you’re gonna create that.

I would say, like, stronger core messaging, like, doing the voice customer research and doing this, like, groundwork and then using that to inform their overall core messaging.

Sure.

Then updating the sales page based on that core messaging, making sure that they have audience attraction mechanisms in place so that they’re attracting an audience that’s gonna want that ultimate offer.

And then what I have currently been calling, like, golden opportunities, but it’s essentially like strategic sequences that upsell, like, upsell cross sells systematized, like, behavior based sequences on the back end to increase the lifetime value of existing customers.

Yeah. Like build on, it’s the that’s just build on that. Like, what you’re creating is your offer, right, and you’re explaining to me how it works with the ultimate goal of of if it’s to increase increase ROI, like, if what it you’re and you’re aligning a metric or a certain lifetime value, you’re aligning a metric to that. It’s very clear and just build that out.

That’s that’s how you’re gonna create the separation and then use your, use your social proof and your credibility booster to say, hey, yeah, what she’s saying is true. This stuff does work. And that’s what you’re gonna sell. You’re selling you’re selling a system.

Right? That’s the apples to oranges. So it sounds like you have a good idea, but that’s the fun of figuring it out. Right?

Like, it’s like if we have GMB as a product type service, so our secret sauce is, like, we go into Google’s web vitals and how, you know, every component of your GMB page, I’m gonna do a session on this. Every component of the GMB page, you know, we use proven copywriting formulas, your Citi page. We use a proven copywriting formula that’s guaranteed not only rank organically in Google, but when people go to the site, it’s gonna convert. And then we set up this.

So we’re we’re telling story and we’re saying, Hey, hire us over the competition. We have a proven process with secret sauce that’s going to get you the consistent results you want. This is why you need to work with us. And it’s like the secret, right?

Or what do they know that? I don’t know. And that’s that’s one of the tricks for product type service as well. Right?

You’re just you’re taking that offer and you’re you’re turning into something great. You ever seen that those shows, how it works on TV? Remember those TV shows? That’s that’s exactly what it is.

Just think in that way. You know, it does this, does this, does this, and it helps them get better than anyone else. And that’s that’s how you really can, beat the, the that’s what I do. That’s that’s how you beat the competition to put a spin on it.

Does that help? Does that make sense?

Or Oh, even just talking through it has helped a lot.

So thank you.

Yeah. No. No. It’s, and that’s, yeah, put it up to, like, competitors. It’s always good to get a second eye on it.

I can look at it from a SEO like perspective and I can tell you, I’m happy to look at it and say, hey, definitely put it up so then everyone can benefit from it, but we’ll look at especially keyword data and Google ads. It tells a lot and you can use Google trends. Tells it all, we can look at their brand terms. Brand terms are great because it’s really gonna tell you, the popularity of their their products and services.

Right?

And especially their coaching programs, you can get a good idea on on, the popularity just by that alone, right, and Google tells you all stuff. And then you can do trends and you can compare it to everybody.

Yeah. So, yeah, put that up. I’m happy to do that.

Any other, any other questions?

No. Okay.

Or any, yeah, true.

Really quick question.

Do you do you recommend, like, having our certifications and badges on the site?

Because, like, Like I’ve always just had them because it assuming it improves credibility, but then I’m also like, do my clients like care that I’m a certified conversion copywriter like, oh, does it just make me look more amateur?

They they care about themself. Right? They don’t they they just wanna, like, ultimately, they care about them and it just, yeah, it helps, but use those to reinforce what you’re saying. Right?

It’s not the end all. Like, it’s not it’s it doesn’t is it is it gonna help? Yeah. Like, is it gonna help to have a logo from Joanna saying like, hey, you know, she’s certified of course.

It’s it’s just gonna say what you’re saying is true. Right? But you’re gonna use that. What we talked about earlier is, like, kinda reinforce your your system, your secret sauce.

Right? That’s the way to use those. Those are like tools to to really support, your messaging. That’s the way I use them.

Right? Like, your credibility booster is gonna build authority and trust your social proof is gonna it’s it’s gotta prove what you’re saying and true. Those are numbers backing it up.

That’s that’s the way we use them. So, yeah, use them. Of course. What are you worried about looking amateur with them? Like, in what way?

I don’t know. It just feels a bit like, hey. I’ve, like, done a training. I don’t know.

Do you know what I mean or is it just do?

Like, I’ve had this conversation with a few people, but is it time to take them all? Like No.

You’re okay. So you gotta you gotta your copywriter. Your your director’s you’re you’re a copywriter. You gotta spin that. So you’re not certified, Joanna.

You’re you’re trained in the the most advanced copywriting technique on the planet. Joanne is considered one of the top copywriters in the world right now. You were personally trained by her. You know her like her like that’s the way to to say it.

That’s not training. Right? These are these are your secret weapons, your secret sauce that you can help them You know, you know, this stuff. That’s the way to position it.

Don’t position yourself as a we’re all students, but you use them to build your authority. Right?

Yeah. That’s such a good point.

Yeah. Like, say, like, we, Google Google ads, like, we work in the EMR. So she’s she handles our our Google ad stuff. She’s top three percent in, Google ads in the world.

Right? And she puts up her Google ad certification, right? And she’s she says, here’s the certification. This is part of the reason why on top three.

Because I take I took all this training. I stay up to date. You know, I look at current trends and I know my stuff. Right?

These are all the books I’ve read in a year. You know, I read hundreds of books just to It changes. It evolves all the time. And she does that because she knew one of the one of the issues clients have is Google ads changes on a dime so fast.

Right? So she’s like, hey, don’t worry. I know this stuff. This is I I look at all the training I got.

So she’s using that to reinforce her messaging. Right? That’s the way to look at it. And try to incorporate it that way.

Sell yourself.

Right? That’s the it’s it’s all it’s all useful.

Boom. Cheers.

Yeah. For sure. What is there a logo that’s like specific one that you’re worried about though to put up?

No. Just like my copy Acres ones. I was just like, is it?

Hobby Acres. Of course.

Join is like if it it’s, of course.

I just I think it’s because, like, because I’ve got my testimony from Joe, and then I’ve got her, like, the featured in, and then I’ve got the training as well. And I’m, like, is this just making it look like I’m just like all copy hackers? Like, do I need to kind of get out of that umbrella a bit and have like, different certifications, because then it’s like, I’m trained by her but also, like, work from her. And it’s like, I don’t know. We’re just and a power note about it.

Build on it. Like, we do there’s a we work with some, especially in, like, the b to c space, like, where we have a results page and, like, half the page is, like, is credibility and we we paste that stuff. Right? Everything from, like, organizations, and it just everything helps.

Right? It’s like that, wow. Okay. This person knows their stuff. Not a an issue, but yeah, put that stuff up.

Just just make it if you can try to make it, try to connect it to something, right, to reinforce your messaging in some way. If you can. But, yeah, copy hackers, that’s a huge one. For sure.

Okay. Yeah. I I think I need to just put, like, a cross head above it that Most of them. Yeah.

Thank you. How did copy hackers has how is it? How does it help you get results for your clients?

Woah. It’s yeah. It’s like the conversion stuff, isn’t it?

Like, there is the the method, but I guess it could, like You network daily with some of the best copywriters on the planet.

So if you have a problem that a client needs to solve, you think you could jump in on the Slack channel and ask a question?

You have access literally to some of the and that’s that’s you see how you positioned it, and it’s true. It’s not just a logo. It’s like it’s what they have access to, what you have access to. It’s just acquired knowledge, right? And that’s the value in this stuff, and that’s the way to position it. This group.

Right? You know what I say? It’s big bucks to do you they couldn’t just go in and ask Joanna or someone question. No.

You have to you you pay them big bucks. Right? You can that’s the whole point of it. Right?

Does that make sense?

And I I mean, yeah, like, I have wondered about that.

Like, about whether I can kind of say that, like, because I’m offering like, but I’m offering like a consultation package at the moment and it’s new And I was thinking, like, can I throw in, like, that I have access to, like, some of the world’s best copywriters?

Or is that No.

You think that’s It’s true.

You’re part of you’re part of the the the the copy hackers pro community and you have a private invite only Slack channel. And in that channel, you always share tips and advice and you work together and you work with some of the best copywriters in the world. Which I’m saying that. Of course you can.

That that that’s a huge and that is your that’s you started to, that’s one of your USPs. It’s one. You can have you can have ten of them, but that’s you’ve just said it. And let’s let’s so now you’re saying, hey, I have access to not I wouldn’t say access, but you’re part of this private community invite only and then you you gauge what we talked about early results.

You you it’s a proven process where it’s built off of control, and you measure success by ROI, and it’s you’re you’re promising something but you’re not. So right away, that’s what we do. I just beat the competition on two usps. You can’t touch me on that.

Right? And especially the one that we talked about with the ROI agencies don’t talk like that. They don’t they don’t understand the concept. And then if and then if someone does beat me or match me, then I get in the consultative selling, say, don’t worry.

We’re gonna work with you because we know the sales close ratio is what has a major impact on your business. So we’re gonna we’re gonna take that sales close ratio from thirty to this. And then someone else matches me, then I’m gonna talk about, hey, we use proven copywriting formulas. We’re gonna increase that lifetime value with some upsells.

So it’s like you’re always you’re always beating the competition in a step ahead, but you’re you’re creating tons of value for yourself. Right? Does that make sense?

Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah.

So to piggyback on this real quick, Shane, do you see this is like making a claim about having access to this kind of ongoing skill development? And then you use the certifications as like a trust builder after next. You’re gonna wait here it that way?

Or Yeah.

Like, say, what I would say is, and and I do say it. Like, what are you? I’m a I’m a copy hacker pro coach. You know, we we we have a private community.

Like, you’re you’re stating the obvious. Like, I wouldn’t say it’s like be careful how you say it. Right? But that’s that’s a fact, right?

You have and that’s a lot of value for clients, right, especially when you hear invite only private access, exclusive. They love that stuff, right? And it’s true. We we help each other.

We work with we do work with some of the best operators in the world. There’s there’s no reason why you can’t say that. It’s true.

Right? And it just it just one more thing to add that. It’s like your u s p. Right? It’s not the tell all, but you’re using that to reinforce. That’s what I do. I don’t see an issue with it.

Yeah. Makes sense. Yeah. Does that does that answer your your question?

Yes. Yeah. And it’s like it’s always there’s so much, and it’s like you sell yourself. Like like David Olegov said, if you can’t sell yourself, you can’t sell clients, and there’s there’s opportunity.

Everything you do, there’s an opportunity a way to position it that sells, right? And it’s it’s done tactfully and it’s true. You don’t lie, but like there’s so much there’s all of these masterminds that people are part but then they don’t mention it. And it’s not a mastermind.

This is an exclusive group of some of the best trained experts in the world, and you’re staying up to date on the lay industries because the industry changes on a dime and as an as a specialist, you know, you need to stay on top of that, you know, and and not and then you back that up with you know, the certifications, and this is why you’re getting the certifications. So, you know, and it’s it’s pretty powerful stuff, but you’re telling a story. Right? And then you’re you’re using that all of that to reinforce your your messaging, your, what I call your, like, your secret sauce, your secret recipe, We do that with GMB all the time.

Right? Or, like I said, our product type service. Right? We have certification I’ve never heard of.

Like, I’ve, they don’t they don’t know. It’s probably, but it’s I’m part of forms, I’m part of communities. I’ll join up to, there’s one I wanna say it, but I’ll join up to this one community which is really well known in the GMB space, and it’s like fifty bucks a month, but I I’ll pay the fifty dollars a month because it it’s really well known, and it’s a credibility booster. It reinforces and it helps us sell.

Right? It’s so there’s that’s the way to position the stuff. Right? There’s opportunity with it.

Does that help?

Yeah. It’s awesome. Yeah.

Any other, Any other questions? Anything?

This is more of a comment. Sure.

I think we know you as the process guy, but I think you might need to be.

I think you’ve, in my mind, you’re now also, how to sell yourself. Like, you’re really you might be able to teach a course on how to sell yourself because you make it sound so easy and convincing. You know, when you talk, I’m like, nodding alone. Yeah.

I’m like, that’s so true. That’s and then, that makes total sense. And then I walk away. I’m like, okay.

I don’t feel as confident anymore. And I what was he saying again, but you have when you’re talking, In the moment, it’s so convincing. Like, yeah, what you say is true and it sounds it’s not made up. It sounds good. It’s not made up.

I don’t know. Anyways, all I’m saying is I feel like maybe there’s an opportunity for you to teach course on how to sell yourself?

Yeah, we did. It’s consulted. We had consulted it. So thank you. Thank you, by the way.

But as we, we started PR and then it went in the consultative selling. And consultative selling is really like direct response. Like, a lot of this stuff comes from, you know, Joanna said to me, study direct response.

That is the the the holy grail. Right? And it’s it’s all about eliciting a response. You want them to take action to do something.

And to to to get them to take action to do something you need to understand them. It’s getting in their mind of the customer. It’s that simple. And once you know the problem and solution, their hesitations and concerns, and you draft a guarantee.

Good luck. And then you create a USB, like, to solve their problem and you show this as a secret sauce, why wouldn’t they choose you?

Well, when you talk about it, it sounds so obvious, and it makes a lot of sense.

But I just I don’t have that same confidence when I walk away.

From this session.

I don’t know if that makes sense.

Yeah. But we can I can help him with that? It’s like, it’s not, yeah, the thing with this, like, director.

You’re talking this up and you’re talking our experience, I’m like, yeah, that totally makes sense. That is exactly right.

And then somehow I lose it from, like, it’s like because there’s a lot going on.

Right? There’s there’s so many moving parts. Like, when I was in the space, it took me it wasn’t until, like, three, five years till I, like, when I first took Joanna’s training, like, it’s, like, fifteen years ago, I didn’t know I was, like, I would I would take the training session and be, like, what the hell? Like, it’s, like, I was like, I I remember going to training saying, like, this is so complicated.

Like, you have to almost be like a scientist just to understand that stuff. And then eventually, it starts to click. And then eventually you understand the stages of awareness. And then you understand stages of awareness are all about, you know, what does the customer already know?

It’s that simple. And then then you think, oh, they already know. That’s okay. I I can answer that question.

And once you know what they already know, now you can start selling them. Right? And it’s like and then you see patterns. Like, for sales, we use Joanna’s question all the time.

Like, you know, what brought you here today? Shut up and listen. They’re gonna tell you the stage of awareness. And if they’re like solution aware, they’re gonna say, you know what?

I’m considering different problem, different solutions. I’m considering you but I’m also not sure if I want this procedure or not, you’re like, okay, solution aware. So you’re not gonna hammer home why you’re different. You’re gonna sell the solution.

But definitely gonna say, you know, I’m comparing you. I’m sold on what you guys are doing. Comparing you to this clinic. Okay.

Your your product order. So I’m gonna sell our USB. Why are we different? Why should you choose Oz?

If they’re most aware. You know what, Evan? Yeah, I’m convinced to go with you guys. I’m just trying to find like a date.

I’m looking for my schedule. What they’re really saying is I want a discount. Hey, we have a limit, we have a date opening up next week. You’ll save three grand.

Can you make it young problem, right? So that by asking, by understanding those stages, you can start crafting messages, right?

And then you can start to see patterns in it as well. That’s what that’s what I would start anyways. Like, are you familiar with the stages of awareness? How they work?

Yeah. Yeah. So I learned like study that. There’s a good book I’ll post on the the Slack channel.

And it goes in the after I read that book, it really hit home. And they break he breaks it down in in detail on how to use it as well. And start with that foundation, and then things will start to and then just to understand, you’re just in the business of selling problems. You’re not in the business of, of selling you or solutions.

You, you solve problems. And then and then your your job is to is to figure out and show them how your solution solves the problem better than anyone else. And that’s your, that’s your secret sauce, your u s p, right? That’s it.

And then that’s the fun part, this, the, how it works, the, the secret recipe, the thing you’ve discovered. And then and then you’ll find you’ll just put a different spin on it and someone will beat you and then you’ll put a different spin on it and you’ll put a different spin. Right? I think there’s like five different versions of the rule of one out there.

I know. But when you explain it, it does sound so easy and obvious.

No. But it’s but it is.

It’s kinda like just focus on those I love the confidence.

No. But it’s but focus on the on this on a it’s a simple pros. Like, even the process I just explained to you, what did I say? All you need to do is you need to figure out who your most profitable customer is.

You need to interview them. You need to once you understand them, you create a profile and avatar, so you can target them. You include demographic cycle graphic because you can use the demographic for campaign data like Facebook, use a psychographic to get into their mind and sell them. Then once you know that, you just create your USB because now you know the problem.

You create your solution. And then you just you you make sure that that solution beats the competition, but you’ve analyzed the competition because now you know what they’re all saying. So you make sure you’re saying the same thing except you’re going a layer above that and you’re beating them with your USB. And because you spoke to them, you know exactly what to say because your customers are gonna tell you.

Right? Simple things like, you know, what what features did you like best? Shut up and listen. They’re telling you why they chose you right?

And those those are those start building on your USB, and then one of those features may be the secret sauce that you get into how it works.

Right, and then you start building layers. That’s it. And then you use a couple of key metrics, like the metrics I showed you on the calculator, there’s only like four there’s three metrics. There’s conversion rate on your your thing. I’ll show you show you quickly as well.

And this is a good one as well to get into. Like remember this as because don’t get focused on. You can see the screen.

There’s only a couple of metrics that move. And as a business owner, just this is like remember what I’m telling you. And when you talk to a client, special a business owner, this is how you sell them. K.

There’s only a couple of of metrics that move the needle in your business. And if you increase any of them five percent, you see explosive ROI. Okay? The first one is your conversion rate.

This is your sales page, your landing page. This is what they hire you for to bring that in. Right? So if you increase this by another five say say you put this to ten percent, Watch how much more you make the client.

A lot of money.

Okay. The next one is your close ratio. This is and this is where agencies fail. They’ll send tons of leads, qualified leads.

But if those leads don’t book, what’s the point? And that’s where agencies fail, but business owners know this is a problem. They’ll say, well, everyone promises leads and you say, well, we’re gonna measure this ratio. And this is this is this is important because this is your close ratio.

And we’re going to apply consultative selling. We’re going to put this to fifty percent, and they’re all they’re all between twenty and thirty percent, by the way. That’s just you can count on that. We’re going to put this to fifty percent.

Look at their ROI. And then they also understand lifetime value and you’re how do you increase lifetime value? We know this stuff. You, you put a order on the thank you page.

Opsol, right? And you increase that even by another one hundred bucks explodes and then this is the secret sauce. This is agent part businesses will know what you’re talking about here is everyone puts this as a hundred percent. Right?

This is your your profit. So everyone uses this metric, but that’s not ROI. That’s return on ad spend. Even Google gets it wrong.

So you’re telling them, listen. Your lifetime value is two thousand two hundred. I know not all that is profit. And they’re like, yeah, exactly.

That’s my gross margin. Exactly. So let’s put you in and there are these remember these numbers, these are the same across the board. Okay?

Your gross margin is around sixty, sixty five percent. Yeah. Yeah. Maybe fifty between yeah. Exactly.

It is. Okay. Great. So we’re gonna put you at sixty percent. I like to be a little conservative.

Let’s put you at, say, forty percent. K? And Now I know your net profit is gonna come around say like twenty, twenty five percent. Those are that’s available information as across the board.

Those are pretty standard numbers. And now the business owner is going, oh my gosh. They totally get my business. They understand me.

Right? And this this is what I just showed you as direct response, you’re showing results, you’re showing value, right, but you’re selling this is part of our USB. This is one of our secret sauces. Right?

We’ve now it works every single time. Does that make sense? Like, it’s how it all works together?

Yes. Just learn those things. It’s it’s not complicated. Conversionary close ratio, lifetime value, done. Those are the only metrics that matter in the business.

Nothing else matters, right? And as long as you’re driving qualified traffic, this matter. You control these, and it’s, it’s so simple and so easy. And then work with them on this, this, this, this, and you’ll notice that when you get businesses busy, because then you you start flooding them, then it’s always an operational issue.

They start to break down because they can’t handle the volume, right, and then their profit margin searches and then you have to work with them to build that up. But that’s when you get into, Hey, I want I want a percentage of sales.

Right? So a lot of clients that we what they used to be clients, but now we we do profit sharing, right? But make no mistake. I know the numbers because the first conversation you need to have with a client, the very first conversation is what’s your lifetime value?

What is your sales close ratio? What is your conversion rate? What is your cost per lead? What’s your your your cost per acquisition?

Right? Because if you don’t have those conversations, you can’t advertise and don’t count on Google to tell you. Google’s system is optimized around cost per lead. Sorry, cost per acquisition.

In your space, in our space, it’s actually cost per lead. You have to go back a layer, but Google doesn’t tell you that. Right? Don’t even measure six that you can import your your ROI into Google ads.

You can do that stuff, but Google that’s like hidden secrets that a lot of people don’t know. Right? There’s another USB, We know this stuff, right? So that we work with clients.

So when we do Google ads, we we measure success by ROI. True, did you actually make money and we link it to the CRM. So I wish I could show you. We have a client who has, this one, our u s p.

So we have a, CRM, So what we figured out is we take lifetime value. So when their patient closes, what we do is we we use Google as API and now we know the exact keyword that that close so we can tie revenue to that keyword. See how powerful that is? And then we can use that metric inside of Google ads to start optimizing campaigns.

That’s data driven. There’s our other that’s another USB, why you should choose us, and you keep on building on that.

Make sense?

Yes.

Yeah.

I just wanted to mention, I really love this method of selling because it makes it feel more logical. Like, look at the numbers.

Like, if you’re turning away from these numbers, then you’re actually making an illogical decision So I really like this method. Yeah.

I’ve never met a client who put me in front of an agency, put me in front of a if if I put me in front of a client, client, like, who works with an agency, you go through this, they’re gonna sign up with you. We still have a client Joe sent to us fifteen years ago. Right? And it’s not that we’re, like, super great at what we do is because we know the numbers, and we just, like, I don’t I don’t even like Google ads, it just once you once you know and you tell Google, I only want you to optimize campaigns based off of revenue using first click attribution to the original channel.

You you can’t lose, like, you you you’ll make money. Right? And then it’s just monitoring those metrics and going and just don’t over complicate but I didn’t invent this stuff. This is like stuff that was talked about in the forties and fifties.

This is direct response, pure and simple. It’s that, it’s that easy. Joe put me onto that, and study that art, study, and then you’ll start to see the patterns, and you’ll see how simple it is. Understanding a problem, offering the solution to solve that problem, separating yourself from the competition, monitoring these metrics, growing your list, selling to that list, sorting by lifetime value, most aware audience, that all that is is is the people, there’s two types of most aware.

There’s there’s the the the people who are on the fence, they wanna purchase with you. Maybe they were they were recommended by a friend or something. They’re convinced you’re the solution. They’re most aware.

They just need a discount. And the other most aware is that they’re on your list they’ve purchased from you previously. Find out who they are, segment by that. Those are your repeat purchases.

Those are your most of our audience, and then just hit them with discounts. That’s it. Where’s the thing on this? Do you see this right here?

I don’t know if you see my screen. Do you see this?

So this is brilliant. So this is like how simple it is. This is from IBuy direct. I purchased these, glasses, I buy direct, and every month I get a card offering a discount.

I’m most aware. I am their most aware audience I’ve purchased. They’ve segmented because I know I’ve made multiple purchases and every month I get it to a card. Hey, purchase again.

We’re thinking of you. Thirty percent off, forty percent off. That’s it. That’s all it has to be.

But there’s so much opportunity in that, right, because no one’s doing this anymore, but it’s as simple as that. That’s direct response.

Make sense?

Yeah. My takeaway oh, sorry, Esther. No.

No. Go ahead, Carla.

My personal takeaway from all of this is let the facts and the data speak for themselves. You know, don’t go down by, you know, I think that my problem is I kinda let myself I just, you know, I get in the way. Like, I just step away and focus on the facts. Like, I think it things are simple to you because you strip everything away and it comes down to the data and the facts. And so to you, it’s very crystal clear.

The benefits and the, you know, what we’re offering. But I think so many times, I, you know, my emotions get involved in my you know, my insecurities or whatever. Like, I bring all that in, I question, bring in all these questions that maybe, I’m making complicating things for myself.

I I work with copywriters because I’m not, like, technically, I’m not a copywriter. I’m a direct response marketer, and copywriters are much better. Like, I understand the psychology behind it. But there’s also there’s the it goes a layer deeper, but I focus on the basics and it’s not.

Some people it’s it’s just that you strip everything down as much as possible and you fold it works for us and it, other people like to be more creative. I’m not I’m not creative. I’m far from it. Like, I’m I just it’s not in my it’s not in my DNA. Right?

But it’s just, I know a lot of copy readers are, but, yeah, it just focus direct response as much as possible, study direct response as much as possible. I think you’ll you’ll like it. It’s all based on data. It’s really straightforward, right?

And then just strip it down and simplify.

It’s fine. When you think about it, all the stuff you can do? Yeah.

I love it.

And then you’ll start making money for yourself, and then you’ll realize, holy crap. Why why why am I not why am I doing this for other people? Right? And then then you get into the real fun stuff. And then it’s all about, you know, yeah, and then it’s about enjoying enjoying life. Right?

But I’ve screwed up a lot of times. Like, I’ve I’ve lost over a million dollars. So I’m not I’m not like trust me. I’ve learned I’ve made a lot of mistakes.

I opened up a clinic in LA, literally, I lost from that six hundred thousand. Right? I learned from my mistakes and it’s not I don’t know But that’s the beauty of of the process of direct response, even Joe’s process, you know, testing and learning that’s built into it. It’s baked into it.

Right? Everything you do is an experiment and you go into it, you build your landing page. You you don’t know if that’s gonna convert. Like, it tells us that should be, you know, long form landing pages convert.

That’s not true all the time. I know for a fact that we’ve put up pages and and like a paragraph converted more. It’s like, how the hell is this happening? Or an image we thought would work is it didn’t, or we were messaging was to a product of our audience, but it would they didn’t but then we put up a discount and everyone purchased.

You’re like, this doesn’t make sense. But now you have a control and you can get in there. You can start figuring it out. Right?

It’s not it’s not perfect, but that gives us to I screw up, I fail every day, right? Every single day, I wake up, I make mistakes.

You know, but what you’re feeling is normal. Don’t I feel that way. I hate, presentations. I don’t like presentations. I hate it. I’m I’m logical. I’m not creative.

Right? And I’m I’m what we call visionary. I’m not an integrator. Right? I have teams and I delegate all this stuff to them.

So it’s it’s very uncomfortable for me to do. Right? Because that’s that’s the way I’m just I’m wired.

But you so what I’m saying is those feelings you’re feeling normal.

Right? It’s completely normal. Right? It’s just everyone everyone thinks that.

Make sense?

Yeah. Yeah. Like, it’s, especially with my team, I hear that all the time. So it is tough, like, it does hit me, like, to hear it because I, it’s and a lot of people feel that in the space.

A lot of people think like impostor syndrome, you know, I don’t look like I’m not an expert. People are gonna think I’m an expert. I don’t know my stuff. Like all of that is completely normal and even people who are in the space who are experts and influencers, they all feel the same.

They’ll journal, they’ll have coaches to deal with those emotions, and that’s the trick. It’s like once you understand that everyone feels the same way, and everyone like, I don’t know. I’ll put you on a secret. I don’t know if you guys have noticed on the the slack channels.

I leave spelling mistakes on purpose. And I I do that intentionally because I’m dealing with, like, with, like, you you take those emotions and then you you make them work for you. And eventually you start building this, like, this wall where it doesn’t matter, and then you realize the world doesn’t care. Like, people that really don’t care.

Has anyone noticed those spelling mistakes I make?

See? Like, it’s like, no what, nobody cares. And it’s like, but I used it ten years ago, I would be so petrified and it’s, but it’s building in that stuff. Right? Like I said before, it’s a bit out there. But, like, I’ve gone to a grocery store, laid in the middle of the grocery store to see what people would do. People walked over me.

They don’t care.

I know it’s a bit out there in Farfetch.

It’s a bit wonky, but it just puts it in a perspective, right? But that’s why people get coached They they work with coaches like Joe said. The coaches aren’t teaching you the practical stuff. They’re teaching you how to deal with all these all these these feelings that what you have are normal. Everyone feels. Imposter syndrome, I think, is the biggest thing students deal with. Right?

But it’s normal. Just remember that Do it anyways. That’s the model. Right?

Yeah.

Anyway, sorry to go off on that. It’s during topic of mine.

Any other, yep?

What resources you would recommend to, like, start off learning direct response.

David Olegle, the one of the legends, the tons. Like, there’s, yeah, there’s tons of books. I’ll I’ll put up a bunch of options.

Yeah, but see, the USP is based off of this one’s scientific advertising.

That’s the whole USB concept where it came out. All, like, all of this stuff that were, like, the direct response, the rule of one. All of this stuff is is it’s just it’s been around for like the forties and fifties and just people are building on it they’re putting like the digital spin on it, but much smarter people figured this out way before. Like they would launch million dollar campaigns with paper.

They didn’t have, like, Excel back then. Right? So they had to simplify it. So one of the rules was you just you assign lifetime value to the original channel, such a simple concept, but today marketers think attribution, this that you have to have that.

That’s not true. Oh, you just need first and last. Use lifetime value, your attribution.

Second click, that’s gonna tell you which campaigns are closing. And then or your first click is gonna tell you as long as you link lifetime dot, like, it’s it’s so simple that we like to complicate stuff, right? We like to have all these different models and then Google says, Now you need AI. You need AI to do that. Yeah. It depends.

As long as you’re tracking ROI to the original channel and you’re using revenue then then it matters, But like how many people, if you guys know clients are using Google ads, I can guarantee that they’re using data driven, but here’s the here’s the messed up part. I don’t know. I’m sharing my screen. Right? So let’s say I send the they’re spending all this money and it’s a ten percent close ratio, right? And everyone’s thinking, oh, this campaign’s doing really well, and Google’s optimizing around this threshold because it’s sending you a hundred delays. Here’s the problem.

Only one of them or zero have booked. The client’s losing money, but Google doesn’t know that because you haven’t closed the loop. So Google’s optimizing around this. That’s what data driven is.

You have to pick the metric. It’s scary.

And everyone’s running around thinking everything’s working for them. It’s not because they’re not closing anything. They’re all shitty leads. I’ve experienced that.

Right? So Google’s optimizing for shitty leads because they’re not they’re not optimized running metrics that matter. Right? So imagine if you’re pumping you know, all of this money.

Now you’re getting into this and say you’re five, like, this I’ve seen this. Like, we did a Facebook campaign which on paper was really well. We generate thousands of leads. Guess what?

None unbooked.

Right? And every business owner you talk to, like, I I I literally, like, fired a client one time. I said, like, I’m not they’re like, we want you to do Facebook advertising. I’m not doing Facebook.

Why? Because I know it doesn’t work. Well, why do you know? And they I’m like, because those are vanity metrics, right?

But it doesn’t, it doesn’t, I don’t like Facebook anyways. It’s it’s like a long term play, but anyway, that’s a totally different story.

Sorry to rant.

No problem. That was really helpful.

Yeah. Thank you. But have fun with it. Right? Like, I’ll I’ll give you some resources on it.

Like Joe’s training, obviously. That that’s peer direct response as peer, computers are copywriting. That’s amazing training. Like that that studying, that’s where I started my training.

And then like Joe said, she mentioned to me as well. Study response, the Grates, your David will hold these.

And you’ll notice, it’s it’s pretty straight. They all preach the same stuff, right? And then just, and then you’ll start to you’ll start to see a pattern and give it a couple of years, but it’ll sink in, right? Then you’ll start looking at stuff and saying, oh, that’s this stage of awareness.

Oh, this is stage of awareness, and then you’ll get mail. It’s like, oh, sign up for everything like every I get so many letters and it does my swipe file. Right? It’s you everywhere you go, go to a national enquirer and sign up for all those little things at the end.

Those are direct response marketers. They know their stuff. And then watch what they send you and step back and start analyzing it. Right?

All of those place. What’s another one? Like, what’s another one like inquire? All those book, look at those those full page ads.

They’re making money can guarantee it. Those that’s a lot of money to be put in there. They know what they’re doing. That’s peer direct response and see what they see what they sense, see what they do and learn. Right? I love doing that, so.

Cool?

Very cool. Thank you.

Yeah. No problem. Any, any any other questions or Okay. Yeah. So hope that, yeah, I hope it was helpful. I look forward. Put up the anything anyone wants me to look at.

Like, put it up in the channel and, Oh, do we get a I do have a question.

Do we get a, do we get the competitive analysis template? Will you be sharing that?

I can. If you want, did you wanna copy of it?

I mean, yes, if you don’t mind.

Of course. No. Of course. Any, the competitor analysis, anything else.

I’m gonna share the, let me show the oh, yeah. Actually, this is a good one. Let me show you guys because, you know, Joe talks about your spit draft and wire for me and whatnot, and when you’re doing your, when you’re creating your pages. So this is what to do.

Do do do do bear with me while I open it here.

And then the survey data, you know the training on that where you take your survey data, you put it in your messaging, and then you take you apply proven copywriting formulas after that?

Yes.

Okay. So that is the so that the concept that we went over will share the whole wireframe with you.

But we have, all of the pages mapped out. And then it’s just really the, the what versus the, the how. And then you just focus on what you wanna say. If it’s yours.

Yeah. I’ll take it out for you later, but it’s a whole, it’s a whole sequence that, anyways, I’ll share it with you. I thought I could find it I’ll share all this with you. I’ll share the competitor research.

I’ll, what else? The, this bit draft and wireframe, the survey questions, that we have. So we analyzed all of the, every copywriter known. We we they all have questions that they ask and then there’s also story frameworks.

So we have the we can pile this massive list of questions that are designed to get a a response from different people. And then you can pick and choose which ones you want, and you can ask those. We’ll send those as well.

Okay. Great.

And then just having fun with it. Right? And, but anything else, anything else you want me to look at on the forms? Like, yeah, put it up, and we can, Happy to look at it too. Oh, we’ll send our, the UVP, sorry, the avatar that we use as well.

Okay?

Thanks, James.

Okay. Thanks, everybody.

Bye. Bye bye.