Okeydoke. Alright. Welcome, y’all. Welcome to March. This is chaos month in, Copy School Pro, and we’re gonna start off, as we should, with the Cosmo quiz.

So this I don’t know if you had a chance to look at it, but this is my poor printout of it. Today, we’re gonna begin with the differentiation Cosmo quiz. It is in the document that was sent to you. Does anybody not have a copy of that?

It’s in your inbox.

I will show it to you as well quickly in case you’re like, what’s she even talking about?

This.

Okay. So this is what we’re talking about. It we’re here right now. For the next two weeks, we’re gonna get a little heavy on who are you and what do you sound like out there, because I’ve seen a lot of people being held back.

I don’t know what to post about. I don’t know what to say. There’s no traction. No one cares.

So let’s, like, push it. Let’s, like, make them care. Like, force them to care what’s what’s gonna happen. People will notice you.

Okay. That’s the idea.

So we’re gonna start with this really it’s a Cosmo quiz because it’s you’ll know. Anybody ever done a Cosmo or a Glamour quiz?

Yeah. Okay. Some of us are I did a lot of them as a teen, and I was always like, oh, you can game this so easily.

Sure. Fine. But just don’t then. So all you wanna do, we’re gonna take a little bit of time. You’ll choose one from each of these sections, and this is for you.

So you’ll it’s identifying you. So it’s in the first person, and if it’s in the second person, it’s you saying that to another person. So you’ll just choose one from each. Just go through and, like, tally it up on a piece of paper if you haven’t printed it off.

And then we’re going to tally up our points at the end. But don’t jump ahead and do that. We’re gonna take five minutes for this part, and then we’ll worry about tallies after. Okay? Five minutes. I’m gonna do it too.

Okay. Is everyone done?

No? Oh, okay. One more minute.

Okay. Let’s call it done. Now you go through, and this is very scientific and accurate, by the way. You go through and you’ll tally up the number of a’s, b’s, c’s, and d’s that you’ve got and pop them in here.

Do that right now and just, like, put up just, like, thumbs up or something so I know you’re done.

K. Abby and Andrew are done.

I missed you.

Jess is done.

And Stacy and Katie.

Cody.

Loving the blazer, Cody. Side note.

So Liesl’s gonna be a little bit late.

Jessica Johnson and Britney, we are waiting on you.

Okay. Since Jessica Johnson and Britney are off oh, Jessica said she’s done.

Great. Johnson, Britney, I’m assuming you’re on track or you’re busy doing something else, while we’re going through. So we’re going to move through to the point where we get our Cosmo quiz assessment.

More a’s than anything else. This is what’s up. More b’s than anything else. That’s what’s up. More c’s or d’s.

If these are true for you, if you got more c’s or d’s and nobody has to confess anything, I recommend that you go oh, good. You guys both done. I recommend that you go back through and do the assessment as a brand that you know of and admire. And I really do mean like a personality brand, like a person, and not necessarily like a like J. Crew. Like, J. Crew would get c’s across the board.

More like Gary v or anything like that. And you can start to better understand, some of the positives of kind of standing out and doing more. Does anybody wanna talk about a reaction you have to having completed this super important cosmo quiz?

Abby? Yeah.

I mean, I said it in the chat. I think the trouble is that it just, like, cycles too much. So, like yeah. I think one of my problems, and I’m not alone, and this group in having this is that some days, it’s like, yeah, like, I feel like I’m crushing it. And then other days, it’s like, I’m an absolute garbage person, and I shouldn’t be talking about copywriting because I suck so hard.

Yeah.

Okay. And others feel the same way, and that’s sort of the problem. Right? If you’re uncertain, then your brand reads as uncertain as well.

So it’s like a matter of pushing it, which is that question about, like, delusion that I had.

This I’m so I’m delusional of my self belief.

I think that that’s an important thing to be as, like, nutty as it may sound.

Don’t it’s just just like, if you’re gonna get out there and people are going to know your brand, it can’t be wishy washy. Right? Like, we can’t be.

We have to really say something. So that was the fun exercise to get us thinking about, and I do recommend that you go through it and retake the quiz as, again, Gary Vee or any of these other brands out there, that you know by name.

Now I wanna move on to getting a bit more real. So what I know is really common for copywriters, in particular, is, like, a tendency toward introversion and shyness, which isn’t really real because a lot of us think a lot of ourselves and think, no. I’m I’m actually pretty badass, and if more people knew that, like, dope.

But there’s also a sense of retreating into yourself.

So I want the the objective today is not just to sit here and be exactly who we are today. Otherwise, we wouldn’t take training. We wouldn’t wanna get better at anything. We would just, like, not show up. Like, ever, we wouldn’t even sign up for training like this and to have somebody encourage you, coach you to do more.

I know for a fact that the thing that is keeping most people when you have struggles in getting leads, it’s because nobody knows who you are. They might have heard of you once, but then they forgot about you. You gotta keep showing up. Your brand has to keep showing up.

So we wanna wake up your brand. Everybody can do this. We do this. I work on this with my coach.

We work on this stuff all the time. It’s it’s an always in progress challenge.

Okay. But what I would love you to do is take some time now to start working through this, and I’m gonna walk through these as we go. I’m not gonna give you, like, a ton of time to write in your answers. If you’ve already done the worksheet, then you already have your answers in there, and you might want to refine them a bit.

But I wanna be really clear. In order to be a world class brand, which is what your clients need to believe that you are, especially as you raise your rates, you have to have this shit locked down. You have to know in the whole world, I’m the absolute best at. When you if any of you already do hang around with people who are uber successful, they absolutely talk about themselves in ways that horrify the little like, for me, growing up in the nineties when, like, shoegazing was how you showed you were cool, when you were like, it was cool not to try, and it was, like, really lame to, like, talk yourself up.

So for me, I have, like, an allergic reaction to hearing this, but I know that it’s critical. I know that when x person says, oh, there’s nobody in the world that’s better than me at this, and that’s why Google hires me all the time, or they just don’t really support it. It just is.

You have to believe. You have to believe. You have to find a way to get there. You have to believe within the whole world.

Nobody, nobody in this room, nobody in any room is better than you at this thing. So start with and I want you to go bigger, like like, really knock through and make yourself feel like like your ego’s too big now. Like, calm down. Don’t, though.

Write it in the least calm down way possible. In the whole world, I am the absolute add in expletives if you want to. Best at what? Write it in now.

Write it anywhere now.

Don’t think forever about it. Just what’s your fucking thing? Just write it down.

When you read it back, you need to know it sounds delusional.

Then you’re probably on the right track.

K? Why do people not just love you, but, like, want to be you? Why?

Write that in next.

And if it includes that your hair looks dope on a regular basis, that is fine. That shouldn’t be the whole thing, but that can be a thing. List it out. List out all your awesome if you want to or just focus on one thing.

Also, don’t list out lots of things you’re good at. Just the one core thing that you’re good at and then other things that make you feel good about yourself.

K.

Alright. Now I had to do this animal kingdom exercise a couple times over the last year and a half, where gorillas and peacocks were, floated.

I recommend that you think about which which animal you are in the animal kingdom. And if you’re not sure, just choose a fucking badass animal. Something really even if it’s badass because it’s the cutest thing you’ve ever seen in your life, but it has to be it can’t be a worm. Abby. It can’t be a worm. It has to be something, yeah, that you can stand behind and that I would say if you’re not sure that people have a feeling about.

So in the animal kingdom, what are you?

Be a child about it. Don’t be smart about it. Don’t be too clever.

Just be a kid.

Okay? Alright. Now everybody who was like, sometimes I’m this, sometimes I’m that, this line is for you. When you have a twinge of self doubt, when something gets in your way, sometimes it’s a whole day of it, sometimes it’s just a just a blip.

What do you remember? What do you tell yourself? What is your motto? What is your thing to get you through?

You may already have it. If you don’t, homework is to go find it.

So what is that thing that you tell yourself when you have doubt about being that animal, about why people love you, about what your thing really is?

Nice, Britney. Nice.

Okay?

And that brings us to the last one, moat building, which is really what everybody AI taught us. You have got to build a moat around who you are, your skills, what you bring to the table, a moat that a bot cannot get through. So how are you building not just a moat, but a super fucking wide brand moat?

What are you doing? What is your thing? How are you making that moat happen?

Moe equals nobody can touch you.

It it shouldn’t probably isn’t a point of, differentiation. That’s like that’s that’s just what got the castle standing, but rather what’s the thing around you where you have to be increasingly widening it, adding new moats beyond the moat so nobody can drop a bridge and, like, hit your castle and destroy you. The moat that keeps you being Katie Peacock.

Untouchable. What keeps you untouchable? And if it doesn’t exist yet, that’s why it says I’m building because it probably doesn’t exist yet.

Okay. Alright.

Does anybody wanna share any of their answers? You don’t share all of them. Anything stand out for you that you feel like cool.

Otherwise, I’ll call on you.

Britney’s come on camera. Is that volunteering? Okay. Britney, let’s hear it.

It’s my sorry for not being able to get on earlier.

Oh, no worries.

So these are basic, but in the whole world, I’m the absolute best at seeing the real problem under the noise.

K.

People love me because I elevate every space, and I see the need and show up without asking.

In the animal kingdom, it’s funny, like, in my house, we have this joke, like, be a fucking tiger.

Okay. Because the spiritual meaning of that is intuitive, senses truth, grounded, leadership can be, you you know, silent, but then also can has power when needed.

Love. But, like, then also I’m like, I have a I kinda like the fox too. Like, good mane, clever, smart, like, gets the job done with few resources sometimes.

Yes.

So when I have a twinge of doubt, I remember sometimes a fox can be a fucking tiger.

So it’s just kinda like the world is our oyster. Right? Like, we can be who we need to be for the moment.

When we encompass kind of, like, that essence, like, the deep down essence.

And then the moat one, I don’t totally understand, but I guess for me, something as I have been building in the last six months, I just have to a, this is like a practical thing, but just, like, keep my reserves healthy so that I’m with. Meaning, like, everything I’ve read about negotiation is that the moment you go into, like, neediness, you lose. And so how do I blinkslate and just with or without you, this is happening.

So, like, a a reserve working on my daily value, like like, I’m just gonna be clear about what I offer and, just a radical commitment to to offering value, I guess, is my moat. But it’s too vague, I know, but I’m working on it.

Cool. And that’s a good thing to work on. Right? Like, I’ve been thinking about our moat for a couple years and have only just kinda got to a place where I’m like, I think this is I think it’s these things.

But the moat might actually be somewhat, like, a even a channel sometimes. Like, what’s the space you’re going to own completely so that anybody who’s, like so nobody can can touch you there. So it’s too late for anybody else who tries to get in, and that could be a book, could be a series of books. Right?

Those sorts of things. That that doesn’t mean it has to be that, though. So I would just, like, keep letting your brain work on, how do I build a moat? What does my moat look like?

How do I make sure that the fortress really is protected, not just by me and my skills, but by everything I’ve done with the channels around me to prevent anybody from coming and taking share from me.

So give it thought.

It doesn’t have to answer it immediately.

Yeah.

What do you think about, so I did some cold calling last week for, like I have a a smaller digital marketing thing, and it went it actually went great. And the feedback that I’m getting is people actually want to talk to the person. They don’t want your setter. They don’t want your salesperson.

They want the person. And so for me, that also plays into mode. Like, hey. Like, when when you’re working with our team, like, at the end of the day, if you need me, like, here’s my cell phone.

So I feel like that’s motive, but also finite. So I’m going you know? Yeah. The resources around your time are finite, but I do like like, just call me directly.

Like, let’s cut the fuss. You know?

Totally.

I that’s great. That’s awesome. And that’s something to think about and, like, figure out how that fits into a bigger brand strategy, having access to you. What does that mean?

In order for someone to want to have access to you, they need to have put you on some level of authority based pedestal. Doesn’t mean that’s always true, but it’s probably true that to get more people and if they care about talking to the person, I need to be the person. So going back through and revisiting everything on here to make sure that you’re, like, nailing it across the board, And then it’s a matter of, I think, then come with other questions around okay. But, like, I don’t scale.

Okay. Well, if you don’t scale, a lot of experts don’t scale, and they raise their rates accordingly. And you only call people who are very likely to be an absolute good fit because you have to choose the right people to call. But I think that’s cool.

I’m so glad that your cold calling went well.

Yeah. It was wild, actually. It was encouraging, and, and I I also was surprised that I had kind of a script, but, actually, people really just, like, almost want one sentence. It’s like the script got condensed to so much shorter than I thought.

But Amazing.

Nice open loop too because everyone’s like, what was the sentence? Tell me the sentence.

But that’s cool. That’s your IP. You have that? Good. That’s awesome. Okay. Also, I love show up without asking.

I wrote that down and circled it. I think if you can live that value, we show up without asking. It’s interesting.

So cool. Any other feedback for Britney?

No? Awesome. Thanks, Britney. Anybody else wanna share?

Anybody else feel anyone if you’re like, I don’t know about this part. Also, like, throw it out there. We can give you some some notes, some encouragement.

I do. You both?

Okay. So I’m struggling with, like, the whole in the whole world I’m the absolute best at.

I have life cycle marketing or, like, decoding human behavior and trust so that SaaS brands can have the life cycle marketing that runs smoothly. I don’t know. But I feel like the thing that I’m best at is seeing life cycle marketing in everything. And so, like, all different patterns of, like, marketing or life. And so I can see how it fits together. And so I can see how their people can then smoothly go through the funnel. But that’s a lot of words.

It’s a lot. And it’s, like, it’s not something that somebody would say about you Yeah. Yet. Right?

Because it’s it’s just not. Right. So what is it? Like, when you think about I’m not gonna name names, but think about somebody who has so much undeserved ego.

I think we all know who.

There’s many of them, but so much shocking amounts of self confidence in spite of everything.

That it it it drives their success in, like, stunning ways.

We can say a thing about each of those people. Any of those people that come to mind for you, you can say they’re really good at this. They’re they’re, like, not just really good that they’re they dominate that thing. Even if they’re not actually the best at it in the in the whole world. So if there’s a sense of I’m going back to nineteen eighties, Donald Trump. We’re not talking about current. Nineteen eighties Donald Trump, the art of the deal.

Everybody, he built a great moat with that. So I’m gonna I’m going to elevate my brand from being the New York guy who has buildings to being, like, the art of the deal guy globally.

Great moat.

In the world, it was assumed that he was the absolute best at putting deals together.

Didn’t really matter if it was true.

The point was not, let’s be let’s be rational. Let’s have proof for everything that we do. All the stuff that the rest of us actually do take seriously. Like, no. I have to be able to stand behind it. I have to prove it, though.

Throw that out for a while and just just be, like, really egotistical.

With that in mind, Liezl, can you, like, embarrass yourself with with how ridiculous your state like, I would push it really hard. If it’s finding patterns, then whatever that might be, k. Now make it, like, make us feel weird about your level of absolute, unordered self confidence there.

I’m trying to think. I don’t know. Okay.

I’m the absolute best at making life cycle marketing work. Doesn’t matter if, like, what where the market is going.

It doesn’t matter if there’s AI. It doesn’t matter if email goes away. I’m the absolute best. I’m making life cycle marketing work no matter the platform and no matter the medium, I guess, or market. Getting there.

I don’t know.

I think it’s getting there. Oh, we’re not gonna get there right now. But I think that it’s a good exercise to go forward, keep pushing on that, sharing them in Slack, or just, like, just, like, push it like, just talk it through with yourself, with your partner, like, whatever it takes, to get there. And then that’s who you are, and everything you say has to just be part of that.

Yeah? Awesome.

Yeah. Push it. Push it push it.

Cody says, mine’s a bit obnoxious, so I’ll share it. Can you come off mute and say it, Cody?

Sure.

So I put, I was using Chat GPT to help me since it knows me so well, and now I had a time limit. But, so it says an unmatched ability to sniff out hidden profit, optimizing shit so ruthlessly that every dollar in ad spend works harder. While everyone is guessing, I’m engineering conversions with the precision of a master strategist.

Nice. Badass. Great.

Cool. Optimizing shit so ruthlessly that every dollar in ad spend, I would just change works harder to some. I know. It this is a little weak. Yeah. No. But the start of it was so, like like, punchy in the face kind of, like, woah.

And then it was, like, works harder. So just fix that part. I know. I know.

I I caught it too.

But yeah. Yeah. That’s cool. Awesome.

Britney, what were you saying about can we give, Leisel examples using life cycle marketing? Is there anything you wanted to add there?

Britney’s busy. Okay.

But if anybody has any examples, okay, throwing it out to the group for Liesl, then, please, go back to that. Cool. Abby says I wanna be the absolute best at selling, period.

I am the absolute best at selling, period.

Yes.

Present tense. You’re already there. No one’s there’s no certification coming. There’s no stamp of approval coming.

You’re just there. Okay. Anybody else any other shares?

If it makes you feel uncomfortable, that’s good.

Okay.

I’ll share.

It feels the reason that it feels uncomfortable is because you literally taught me this, and so I’m like, can we just remove you from, like, people?

Remove. Let’s let’s just pretend you don’t exist. Okay. Cool.

So in the whole world, I’m the absolute best at life cycle email strategy. When I talk to people who think they know anything about, life cycle email strategy, they realize they need to sit down and listen because they don’t actually know anything.

So that’s that’s that.

K. In the animal kingdom okay. I don’t know why this popped into my head, but I picked a moose.

Okay. And yeah. It’s very Canadian.

Yeah. What came to me after was it’s because they’re elusive. They’re rare. Everybody’s always like, I want to see a moose in real life.

Oh.

People stop when they’re around. Like, you literally have to stop your car. If you see a moose, you’re like, oh my god. I need to stop. You’ve heard of a moose, and you’re like, oh, damn. But then when you see one, you’re like, oh, fuck. Like, I actually had no idea.

And then when I have a twinge of self doubt, I remember that there’s a white dude spouting shit on LinkedIn who doesn’t know anything, who’s acting more confident than you and making more money than you, and so that needs to change.

And then I’m building a super wide brand moat with the state of report that I’m doing, so the state of free trial onboarding sequences in twenty twenty five.

Nice. And I just decided this weekend, I’m gonna start a YouTube channel as well.

Okay.

Build that moat. Yep. Amazing. Okay. Wait. Why do people fucking love you?

Because I’m really smart and great at business, and people always think that I’m really cool.

Okay. Dig it.

And I like that. Cool.

Excellent.

Awesome. Good.

Okay.

Alright. Britney says you have Riz. Awesome. I said Riz in front of my nephew, and he nearly died. He was like, now That word’s dead.

Okay.

Jessica’s up on the absolute best at coaching people through writing and publishing their book. Try harder, Jessica.

Excellent.

Okay.

Wonderful.

Let’s Stacy, are you going to share yours?

Yes. I’m going to because it’s so weak that I need to share it so I can make it better.

Okay. Let’s do it.

I mean, it’s just it’s the the kernels of it are there, but hearing the oomph of the other ones was just like, oh my god. This is so weak.

So the the best in the world is I’m I’m doing this about my, about my software.

So Yeah.

It’s I I built the absolute best AI for marketing that creates the most value with the least amount of effort, which is Okay. Objectively true. It just doesn’t have enough oomph.

And people fucking love me because I speak my mind. I’m successful, laid back, can figure out anything. I’ve I’ve done I’ve lived a thousand lifetimes already.

I I don’t know. I guess they think I’m a cool person.

My animal kingdom is an albino Siberian tiger because it wasn’t enough to just be a tiger. It had to be a very, very rare thing, and the Siberian tiger is, like, the apex predator. So, that’s why I picked all of those, along with the tiger, spiritual aspects too. So it’s a complete package.

When I have a twinge of self doubt, I remember I’m Stacy Moore.

That’s so Oh, nice.

That’s baller.

I mean and that is really true.

So that part, I feel good about, the the strength of that one.

The moat, I don’t have anything strong there.

I just you know, the the the AI of choice for the best marketers in the world is is what I wrote.

So open to feedback.

Okay. Feedback.

Room. Everyone here knows how it’s supposed to sound, but we’re aiming for Nice, Abby. Awesome. K. Notes for Stacy.

Let’s start with in the whole world and the absolute best at.

Does anybody remember it?

I was expecting more because No.

Because it’s totally not memorable.

It was it was to do with your AI.

But, Stacy, I feel like we can always trust you to bring, like, the kind of Apex confidence. So I was expecting you to just be like, in the whole world, I’m the best at everything.

That’s funny.

I think that’s the problem.

Right? It was not memorable, and it’s not in keeping with what we know of you, Stacy, which yeah.

Anybody else have any notes to help Stacy out here?

We’re pushing it.

Questions for Stacy to help her?

Cody, Abby, looks like you’re both thinking.

Yeah. I was I was thought of one, but then I was like, it’s still not good enough. But, like, turning, like, chatbots or AI bots into, like, your world like, world class copywriter, like, something around that. Maybe. I don’t know. Because it’s like you make the AI, like, the the best copywriter, like, they could ever work with.

But it’s not enough.

Like, the easiest blank in the least amount of effort.

So that’s just like marketing talk. Right? But, like, what do those things like how do you make it obnoxious now so that we’re pushing it in the right direction?

I don’t know. I mean, I make AI that can do your job better than you so you can so you can wow your clients. I mean, it’s really the thing. You know? But it can’t because it has to have the people, but but that’s the, you know, the gist of it.

But it’s not a cop it’s not copywriting AI. It’s just it it’s writing is one thing. It’s strategy research writing. It’s so much more than copywriting.

Yeah. That’s one component. I’m looking at the at the comments.

Yeah.

So that’s fair. So if we get rid of copywriting, but then there’s the question, okay. Do your job better than you is nice. It’s obnoxious, but it’s also terrifying.

Yeah. It is. It it is, and it’s not it’s not the ethos of what I’m doing too, but but something in that direction that actually fits is Yeah. You know, is a good thing to think about.

Exactly. I would just think about that. Going in that direction of, okay.

So if do your job better than you is sticky, it’s just not what’s your dream. Who wished if you’ve always wished you could clone yourself Yeah.

You know?

But, like, you know, it’s not that it’s not that either because I don’t want I don’t want people to think it’s like an AI clone of yourself because it’s not that either.

Yeah. Yeah. I would just work on how do you make the do your job better than you fit now with what you really believe in?

Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Because it’s it’s something that we can we can see it now. We can, like, understand it and, like, feel slightly threatened by it and, like, wanna react to it. And that’s, like, what we’re going for. Right? A reaction to our brand.

Hopefully, the right reaction, but some people will find will be angry with us.

Okay. Alright. Thanks everyone for sharing. Your next objective, your homework is to do something super lame, which I do recommend.

I’ve actually got mine on order. This is my little little dude, is to create a visual of that animal.

Really bring it to life with AI and then get can put it in Canva and go get it shipped to you and put it next to your computer. And when you’re not sure who you are and what you do and why people do care, not just should care, but do care, then you could look at that.

That is it. Go through, revisit this.

Make sure you got a brand, a good brand that you stand behind. Alright. Next week, we will be talking about this as there’ll be a part two. Basically, it requires that you have done the work from this week to move forward in week two.

Those are the only two parts of chaos month that, like, work together. Okay.

Now we’re in that part of the day where we have q and a. You have a question. Please raise your hand.

We’ll start with what should we start with? Not a win.

Your goal for the month of March, a measurable goal. It can’t be qualitative. It has to be quantitative. What do you what is your goal? Target for March for March. Abby, you’re up first, so now you have you’re on the spot to come up with it immediately.

Just close another client, I think.

Put a number on that. One one client. One client at? What’s their value?

Oh, at fifty with an optimization retainer.

You already are doing that every single month. That’s Yeah.

So I wanna keep doing it. I wanna keep doing it.

I’m like lose momentum. Keep going.

I’m waiting for the, like, the the you know, when you think you’ve got it all figured out, and then the dip comes, you’re like, I didn’t have it figured out.

It’s all okay.

Alright.

Okay. So, yeah, my question is when someone comes to me and they don’t want, like, my standardized offer as it is, I don’t know what to do. Like, I will drop my prices. I will panic. Like, I just it’s a massive blind spot for me. So I got I got this email. I’m gonna pop it in the chat if that’s okay.

Okay.

So they want a sales page revision and an evergreen sales email series.

And I just don’t know what to do with that because I can’t be like, well, you need they want evergreen. It’s fifty k.

And I can’t be like, I I’m not gonna put it in VIP week. Like, I’d love to still close them at, like, twenty, thirty k, but I don’t know.

Dot what is happening here? Questions galore. Okay. Where did this email come from?

Like, is this, we’re reaching out to you first email or has it Yeah.

This was a, a lady someone filled in my, like, I want to work with you form.

Okay. So you haven’t spoken with them yet?

I booked a call for Friday, and I Okay. Wanted to check-in first because otherwise, I’ll just close, like, something stupid.

What makes you believe that this lead knows and is right about what they want?

Like, everybody has an idea. Like, you go to the mall and you’re like, I want new jeans, but then you, like, try on not jeans and they’re dope. And you’re like, never mind. I want these, and maybe I also want new jeans.

We don’t know. We just think we know. Right? And so I mean, extremely successful is, like, confident.

Right.

So you have looked into their brand, and it’s an extremely successful brand.

Well, she said her freebie is extremely successful.

Because it’s got forty thousand downloads?

Well, it it says a revision of our extremely successful free or free freebie, with sixty seven five percent over forty thousand.

Do you do you believe these numbers?

Do you believe that they have a seventy five percent open rate across nine emails? Yeah. You do?

Yeah. I get that because it’s a Everybody here.

By email eight, you’ve still got a seventy five percent open rate?

No. Across the emails. Like, it averages around that.

I have worked in email a long ass time, and that is suspicious to me. I’m like, hold on. Let’s open up. Show me show me your like, let’s go into your CRM right now.

So it’s not that, Abby. And I’m not like but I would look at this and go like, thank you for believing you know what you need. That’s that’s great. You’ve given some thought to this. Awesome.

Now you throw that part out and you back the conversation into the actual conversation that you always have. Get on the call. Thank you. I saw everything. I saw, like, your list. It’s a great grocery list. Let’s talk right now, though, instead about, like, what’s going on in your business right now.

Why are we talking today? If it’s because they need a sales page revision, they’ve come to the wrong place. You’re not a sales page revisionist. That’s not if they’re looking for that, they can find that anywhere online. There’s, like, a million people who will do that. So why did they come to you? What’s going on in their business?

Why you? Why now? Always those same questions.

So I would just back up.

There’s still a prospect for the project, aren’t they? Sales page revision, the it’s for an evergreen flow?

Yeah. So they want an evergreen funnel. They just don’t need the whole thing. So they say.

The course is older.

We haven’t really done much with it since the launch, but it’s core content for us, and I want it to be a bigger part of our environment.

So so what are we hearing? What do you hear when you hear that? Like, really quick reaction to reading that. Forget about just even I want it to be a bigger part of our environment.

That they they want an evergreen sales funnel that works.

Yeah. They want what does it I would like okay. So they their problem internally, they’re thinking and I think they meant ecosystem, but they said environment. I don’t know what that means.

But I would dig into that. Like, what do you mean a bigger part of, like, this world that you’re creating for your product lineup, I assume?

Get them to, like I’d start there. Talk to me about what’s going on with this.

And then looking at your ballpark project budget, we’re probably about halfway in between a VIP week and a full funnel because we have at least some of the assets already.

No. I think this is, like for me, Abby, I look at this, and I just get them into your standardized offer. Like, that’s your objective.

This is fine that they think they want these things, but the more they start talking Mhmm. Because you’re asking all of the questions you would ask anybody who it doesn’t even matter what they put in their intake form. Fine. Fine.

Great. Cool. It’s not that you ignore it, but you really don’t have to think that much about it. Find the parts that are their obvious, like, openings in a sales conversation.

Now we want it to be a bigger part of our environment. There again, I don’t know what that word means. You’ve done all of these things.

You’ve had success with this freebie.

Why are they coming to you right now for an evergreen funnel, though?

That’d be my like, that’s the question.

And what’s stopping them? Have they done a webinar before? Because you largely just do evergreen webinar funnels, don’t you, Abby? Yeah. Yeah. So I’m looking at that going, like, have you tried a webinar funnel before?

How did that go? Oh, you didn’t? Why not? The usual, like, sales questions. I wouldn’t worry about a single thing that they’ve said in there, But, like, pull on the obvious, for me, it for me, it feels like, wow. This is a good lead purely because they’ve given you so much information. They’ve told you things that are pretty revealing about the place that they’re at in their business.

They care about this or they wouldn’t have told you this much. They’ve looked through your offers, so they’re doing all of the good research that’s like buying signals.

But they wanna believe they’re a VIP week, which you have to get off your site. And maybe you’d be a full funnel, but they have some of the assets already. So all you have to do is move them from where they are toward, oh, we do need a full funnel. It doesn’t matter that some of the assets are ready already. Every funnel you start with, as far as they know, already has assets ready.

Mhmm.

It’s got nothing to do with adjusting price because you’re not doing some assets. That’s always the case. They’re not hiring you for assets. They’re not hiring you for what’s there to fill in the gaps. They’re hiring you for a high performing evergreen funnel.

That’s it.

Would you would you do the diagnostic then for something like this so I can show them, like, they’re not as in the green as they think?

Probably.

If I would do it in advance just to make sure, like, is this going to make me look better or worse when it’s done? If it’s a good diagnostic, it should always make you look better in the end.

But this is a different sort of scenario. So, yeah, I would try the diagnostic out first, make sure it works, walk them through it. Yeah. I don’t I guess I’m just wondering.

I think that more of it has to do, Abby, with you once again need to, like, look at your your your brand, who you are.

There’s no modifying your price. Why would you suddenly modify?

Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Thank you. That’s helpful. Yeah.

And I don’t mean to if it’s coming off harsh, I don’t mean to No.

No. But I need it.

Yes. It’s fifty thousand doll that’s what your rate is fifty thousand dollars. If I walk into Louis Vuitton and I want a twenty thousand dollar bag, but I don’t need the handle that comes with it because I have my own handle. Nobody’s like, oh, then it’s only eighteen thousand.

The price is the price no matter what. That’s it’s just the price. It’s Fifty thousand dollars. That is the thing.

Let me walk you through how I get results for people with this funnel. Talk about your results, always your results, what you do, how great it works. Suddenly, they’re able to find fifty thousand, and those assets that exist don’t really matter. For this old course, they haven’t invested in, and they know that there’s money hiding in it.

You’re gonna unhide that money with your process.

Mhmm. That’s a really helpful mindset, chef. Thank you. By the way, they they said they wanted someone whose copy hackers trained.

Yeah. They did.

Just kidding. Just kidding. That’s awesome. Look. Everybody’s got your back here too, Abby. You already I think you do know.

It’s a mindset thing. Just practice.

Yeah.

Okay. Thanks, everyone.

Thanks, Debbie.

Job, Abby. Jess, what’s your measurable target, goal, whatever it might be, for March?

So my goal is to finish opting into the hundred free trials. So I’m at fifty four right now.

And this is as part of your bigger study?

Yes.

Excellent.

Yes.

So you’re gonna finish so you’ve got forty six more that you need to do this month.

Yeah. I can pretty much opt into if I like, in three hours because I’m taking, like, screenshots and stuff of things. Yeah. I can do, like, twelve in three hours.

It’s there’s a lot. There’s a lot. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Good.

Nice. So yeah.

So my question is when we first talked about this, you were saying to release this in partnership radar or find out who I reach it reach out to to, like, do this with?

What what would you recommend that I do at this time?

Yeah. Definitely. I think, I think what’s important to know is that behind the scenes at these organizations in their content teams, across all their teams. There’s boardrooms, breakout rooms that have whiteboards in them. And on those whiteboards, they write names of people that they would love to bring in. This happens all the time. So if a content team is sitting around brainstorming and they’re like, we need new we need some some sort of we need something in q three that’s all about life cycle emails.

Who do we know that can create some life cycle email report for us? Let’s say. Now we don’t know that that’s what they’re thinking. You have to make them think that with your marketing to begin with, and your job is to get your name on that board. So how do you get your name on the board?

What do you have to do to get seen by the people who are writing names on boards?

Do you have any ideas?

I mean, create content that they would see.

Promote content that you probably already have, but okay. Yes.

Yeah. I don’t have a ton of content, but I am starting to make it more regularly.

And it’s been really I actually have been having, like, a lot of fun with it, which is good.

Yeah.

Which is why the YouTube channel because I’m like, I think if I had more space to talk about things than, like, a three to five minute reel, then, yeah, it’ll just it’ll be really good.

So, so then we have to figure out how to get it in front of them.

Yeah.

K. So that’s a whole question.

There’s tools. Right? Like, we can go back through and look through LinkedIn sales navigator and other tools like that.

Unfortunately, you can’t target ads directly at people on LinkedIn, which I think is a major miss, but whatever. Mhmm. I get that is creepy. So, okay, there’s that. But then there’s, like, forming relationships as well. Mhmm. How do you figure out let’s say it takes three months to kind of ramp up a bit of a relationship, let’s say.

So you have to start now Mhmm.

In order to be on their radar at in the mid at the end of q two.

So how can who are the people that you need to form that relationship with? Let’s go into LinkedIn sales navigator, find everybody at HubSpot who and and other HubSpot like, businesses because a lot of them have shared little private Slack groups that they’re in together. So head of content at Intercom knows head of content at HubSpot. If their their influencers are talking about you, even lightly, they they reshare a post you did in that Slack group that they’re all in together or WhatsApp or whatever the thing might be.

Good. Now your name is circulating. So it’s like in sales navigator who’s a senior content strategist who is like a content acquisition, editor. If there’s one of those out there, that’s a no brainer to just flat out pitch them on that.

But find who they are, make a list in LinkedIn sales navigator, save them as a list. Great. And now you start to do your account based marketing approach, but in this case, it’s not selling a service. It’s selling you as you, expert.

They need to know. Does that mean you have to get on some podcast? You use SparkToro a bit to see what they’re reading, what they’re thinking about, where they’re doing that?

Yeah.

But when it comes down to it, it could also just be like, that’s a lot of plates spinning. You could also just, like, target one person. Say like Mhmm. Okay. Every week, twice a week, I’m going to do something. Do x thing for that person. And you might get so targeted that you just send them a gift.

Say, I have something cool for you. I don’t know how to get in front of you, so I’m sending you these donuts. I hope this is your address.

Whatever that might be, and they’re not used to getting those things. Right? They’re just a lowly content person. So there’s lots of ways around it. Direct might be the cheapest way.

Cool.

Yeah. Okay. Yep.

It’s gonna be really high value. I think that they just don’t yeah. I know it’s hard to start doing that that work, but yeah. Anyway, I’m excited for you. Okay.

Yeah. And well and just like some of these things that I’m finding are literally blowing my mind. Yeah.

I can’t wait to have a hundred and, like, break it all down. It’s like it’s so crazy.

So part two to the question is I’ve been trying to also collect other state of reports so that I kind of can break them down and see what people are including in these. So I have a couple, and I was just wondering if anybody or, Joe, if you know of any good ones that you read recently that you’re like, this was absolutely amazing. Like, Calendly has one on, like, the state of meetings and things like that. So, yeah, does that can anybody think of any reports?

CB Insights always does good state of reports, but they have their whole insights team now. Like, they’ve turned into just this giant research body, but they’ll, they’re good to look at CB Insights. Anybody else? Unbound, Sandra says maybe.

Experian. Yeah. Experian, Gartner. Amazing.

Yeah. Amazing.

Yeah.

Cool. Thank you.

Awesome. Okay. Good?

Cool. Thank you.

Thanks, Jess. Alright. Liezl. Measurable goal for March.

Yeah. Okay. So I have a couple. I wanna land two calls by the end of this week, at least. Okay.

And then schedule two workshops by the end of this month, but I’m hoping, like, by the end of next week as well. Nice. I just don’t know how heady of a thing it is.

Okay. Got this. I do.

My question is, so I created my diagnostic flywheel over the weekend. Great. And I I would like feedback on it if possible. It’s on my Notion board. Do you want me to just share my screen or how?

Share that screen. Let’s take a look. Anybody who has done a diagnostic or worked through it, it’s a great time to get your notes as well.

Let me know if you can see that.

Then.

Do you like it? Yeah. Okay. Good. It took me eight hours. So, you know, if I have to do it over again, that’s okay. I’ll just cry.

But it’s patterned after after, like, the product led growth flywheel because the people already really recognize that and really love that in the industry.

So that’s what I did. I want to do, like, these the same color as this or whatever, but these are the three breakdowns.

These are the phases.

These are the questions I ask Yeah.

Etcetera.

Right.

Just look at do you think my question is, do you think that this will give me the desired result of having them say, oh my gosh. We need to work with you right now.

Can you scroll back up to the flywheel?

Yep.

So when I complete this, what happens? So you walk me through it. Where does it start?

It starts, on analyze right here.

K. So retention.

Mhmm. Team insights behavior tracking. Then Then we move and that’s where we do, like, a red, yellow, green or a scoring of some kind on each of those? Okay.

Yep. So I was asking them yeah. So I’m part of a a life cycle marketing Slack group. And so a lot of these are panned after what people are who are experts in the field doing this every day actually ask in the Slack book or a group all the time. So these are things that help them also if I suggest.

Can I walk away with once this is done? Once I’ve gone through the diagnostic in your workshop, what do I what’s what’s changed for me?

You know where you need to improve. You know what you need to improve without knowing the how. So you could go do it yourself, but you feel just enough overwhelm and friction from it to say, you know what? I will have to do so much research to even figure out how to fill these little gaps or how to find this that I don’t want to. I wanna hire a lease.

K. And then I have, like, these pitch like, workshop pitches that me and Chad GPT came up with.

Okay.

But Yeah.

I think, like, the outcome so if I’m thinking about it as, like, okay. You’re so who’s someone that you would pitch this to? Not the person, but a brand.

I’m trying to think. Chili Piper comes to mind, but their sales led. Okay.

Let’s say Chili Piper.

We pretend. Yeah.

Cool. So Chili Piper, in their audience, there are a lot of people who should be hiring you. Okay. So you tell Chili Piper, hey. I’ve got this great diagnostic. You You don’t say it that way. That will help your users be better users of Chili Piper because they will know what to work on using Chili Piper?

Yeah. I’ll help them use Chili Piper faster.

Chili Piper is, like a intake form where they can just fill it out and get calls real fast from from people.

So yeah. Yeah.

So complete this and see to help your users take action faster so you can get more people through the funnel. And I know what they’re struggling with particularly. That’s why I chose Chili Piper.

But Yeah.

That’s really so cool. So I mean, it looks good.

The yellow, I think, maybe on the screen, the yellow is messing with my brain a bit. It looks like a rectangle. There’s something going on there. It might just be me. But the yellow is a little bit muted and, like, like, there’s a weirdness for me. But other than that, everything is really clear.

Yeah. I mean, I think if you can start, just pitch it to Yeah. People today. See what comes back.

Okay. So just pitch the flywheel, like, not even necessarily, like, a workshop.

No. The workshop. No. Don’t get me wrong.

You are Yeah.

Okay.

For two workshops scheduled this month.

They could both happen today. You could be done target met today. How do you do that?

It wouldn’t just be, hey. Look at this diagnostic.

Nobody knows what the fuck to do.

Right? So what I would frame it differently. Yeah. I would say, hey. Like, depending on what they’re struggling with, I can help you figure out where you’re where to begin or, not even that.

Yeah.

What to work on and what doesn’t need to work on.

Those guys are really big business question. What do I work on and what don’t I need to work on? Yeah.

But do I wanna get more targeted than that? Sorry.

My brain is like Yeah.

Well, it’s not gonna be that’s not like maybe it is. Maybe you do a single line pitch to a couple people that’s like, do your users need to know what to work on versus what not to be better users of Chili Piper?

Yeah. To watch this video or whatever. I don’t that’s not it. Yeah. But Right. Need to see I think you need to give a sample of who you are and Yeah.

What this diagnostic is all about by recording, not a custom one for every every brand. Just do one recording. The email can be custom. You’re just trying to knock through these things.

But do a video.

Put it on the landing page that has information about you, what makes you great, who’s trusted you before, why the right to trust you, what a workshop would look like, who you’ve presented for before. Just, like, really pull it out of the woodwork. Like, whatever Yeah. Anything.

Anything that you’ve done that’s remotely, like, oh, yeah. I somewhat indirectly consulted with that group. Cool. Right.

And then just walk through one section. So I’m just gonna give you a taste of what they will see in the workshop. And if you don’t love it, then you’re not gonna love the whole thing. But if you’re intrigued, if you think your audience will be intrigued, if they are struggling to know what to work on versus what not to work on, and that is possibly making them not as great a user of Chili Piper, then you can bring me in for this workshop.

I will run this thing for free, and I’ll promote it with my etcetera etcetera. But just show them, like, one part of it. Like, we’re gonna start with the analyzed part. Here’s how the workshop would run.

Here’s what this diagnostic is about. Walk them through it just like you would. And then Yeah. That’s it.

Call to action. Ping me. We can get this booked in this quarter.

Whatever it might be. Yeah.

But do you intend today?

K. I will.

You did the homework this weekend. Good job.

I did it. Thanks. Thanks. It worked hard. Thank you.

Cool. Any notes? Any other notes for Liesl other than Jess loves it?

Great. Thank you, Jess. Cool.

Alright. Andrew. Looks like last but not least, Andrew.

Hello. Hello.

Hello. Hello.

Mhmm. My, my measurable goal is that I will close one new retainer client this month.

Nice.

And that’s already on track. My question is around so this came up while we were doing the exercise around, like, what are you what are you the absolute best at, or what are you going to be the absolute best at? And something that has become clear to me is that, like, the the copywriting part, is probably not where, like, I’m the you know, I I right now, I’m working on a project with a partner.

Like, she’s a better copywriter than I am. She’s better at the, like, the research and all of that, and that’s that’s fine. That’s cool. That’s why I brought her in.

Yeah. And so where I sort of see myself wanting to move is, like, I and and as I was writing this out, it’s like, I want my thing to be around, like, finding the most valuable opportunities. So, you know, I work with b to b SaaS clients mostly on websites and landing pages. And so, like, the way I think of what I kinda wanna be known for is that it’s like, I’m gonna be the one who’s the best at, like, prioritizing the work that needs to be done of sort of, like, figuring out what you can ignore and where you’re gonna get the most bang for your buck and Mhmm.

Kind of, like, the most valuable opportunities.

And I guess, one, I’m wondering if that, like, is kind of a I guess I’m looking for, like, validation on that. And then I guess the second part is, like, I guess I you know, I’m starting to think more about, like, developing more CRO specific skills and, like, do I go down the route of, like, getting all the way in on, like, GA four and things like that that I’m, like, not super used to, or is that, like, a total waste of my time and, like, all of that kind of thing. So, like, I’d love it if I could be the kind of person who comes in. I look at everything holistically, and it’s like, here’s your number one spot.

Here’s number two. Here’s number three. Here’s how we can test this. And Mhmm. I chose an eagle because part of it is I don’t wanna be I’m, like, I’m above the little stuff.

And, like, and, like, I’m not going after seeds and worms.

Like, I’m going after like, give me an animal that’s, like, bigger than me.

Totally.

Yep. So, yeah, just just just that’s kinda where I am right now.

Okay. Cool. That’s fun.

I love that you’re getting there and that you’re seeing that.

Yeah. I wrote down we find and or something. I wrote down projects that crush.

I feel like there’s a lot of value in being that’s why people spend so much money on a direct response mailer, because it’s it’s going to crush, and it’s completely different from everything else you’re doing in marketing. It’s a pretty sure thing, and it costs a lot of money. But, like, you dedicate resources to that.

I don’t think so I think it’s great that you’re like, we’re gonna I I don’t mess around with piddly stuff. Good. Nobody in this room should either, and it’s good to position yourself as like, no. That’s not for me.

I don’t do that. It’s great that some someone else can work on your about page. It’s not gonna be the thing that’s going to explode your business. Like, let’s work on the thing that really will.

Otherwise, I’m I’m not of use to you. Great. And then what was the second part?

You had something else.

Oh, you had the No.

I said I said I I had the animal. I also said g a four, and you made a face.

Oh, yeah. No. So it reminded me when I was an early, like, a just starting out as a copywriter a year in, we worked I wrote copy for this, wealth investment fund guy.

And he had when you signed on with him, he he had a network of people who were great at things. Maybe I’ve told this before.

So if you need an estate lawyer, he doesn’t do a state law. He’s not an estate lawyer, but he knows a good one, and they’re part of his ecosystem, and you get private access to them. So that’s something to consider with things like GA four. You don’t wanna become a GA four expert. You don’t wanna go into that world full stop. It’s messy. It’s hard.

It’s hard all around, but you know it’s important. So who do you know that is good at that and that you can swap in and out of your team as needed? They don’t have to be full time. They’re just somebody that you bring in to work on a project upfront. That’s why I had Nicole Luke, who I worked with at Intuit. She’s an analytics, like, mastermind. Like, she’s freaking brilliant.

She didn’t wanna have a full time job, so I would just hire her to consult, come in for a couple hours. She’d build sad little amounts that I never talked her out of because I wasn’t her coach.

But you can go out and find those people and have them as, like, a secret private resource exclusively for clients.

And then you don’t have to know it. You just have to know who does know it and bring them in.

That helps. So and can I just ask so something that I kind of struggle with with this idea of, like, oh, I’m not, like I don’t know what my one thing is is, like, I wanna kind of have, like, a thing that I can pour a lot of, like that I can really, like, spend time on? Like, I carve out time every week to just work on developing this skill. Yes. And I’m trying to figure out what that is. I don’t know if there’s anything you can do to kinda, like I don’t know. Any guidance you can give to help me figure out what that is, but I don’t that’s a tough question.

I can keep, like, workshopping it with you as you bring new ideas. And I think that you’ve got something, though, with, like as a starting point. People don’t wanna work on low value stuff, and so much marketing feels like chaos. We’re all just guessing at everything.

We’re only doing this because we’re supposed to do it. No one really gave that much thought to it. And then a CEO or a CMO gets, like, annoyed. It’s like, can we just do something that’s gonna move the needle, please?

Like, I’m tired of posting comments on Reddit. What can we do? And you’re the guy who answers that.

I love that.

I think you just have to keep working it and then bring your ideas back, and we’ll get there.

I think it’s the big swing thing. I think that there’s something around that.

It’s the big swing doing business.

Swing, though. Right? Like a mailer. Like, it’s an eight part lumpy mailer kit. I’m not saying you do that.

I’m saying, like, that is a clear different tactic that nobody saw coming. Someone learned about it or they do it every year, and it always is, like, brings in incredible results. It’s a big swing because it’s so different from everyday marketing.

It’s not digital marketing. It’s old school. It’s like, it makes everybody feel uncomfortable in the room because we’re so used to, like, more ad spend, more emails.

So, yeah, I think that if you can figure out what big swing, how to revise that to get to a place where it’s like, it’s not just try something like a big swing homepage.

It’s like, what is it?

I don’t know.

You’ll get there.

K. That’s helpful. Thank you.

Cool. Awesome. Thanks. Alright. Y’all, we’re at the end of our time.

We’re either over if you have it in your calendar for sixty minutes or under if you have it in your calendar for ninety. It goes both ways.

But that’s it. No more questions in the room. So thank y’all. We will see you on Thursday for Ryze. Very cool session.

And, then, otherwise, we’ll see you next week for part two of you are a media brand. Alright.

Have a good one.

Bye. Thanks.